Thought I'd start a new thread as this is going to be a major talking point this year...have not made up my mind yet...(unlike bucksfizz)....but thinking of voting for an exit as Europe is not doing Britain any good at all it seems....

Whats the latest Fred has she declared UDI yet?

With apologies to Will.

May and her tory collaborators.
(Including, Dil, Manuel, It)


Their revels now are ended. Those our actors,
As I foretold you, were all spirits and
Are melted into air, into thin air:
And, like the baseless fabric of this vision,
The cloud-capp'd towers, the gorgeous palaces,
The solemn temples, the great globe itself,
Yea, all which it inherited, shall dissolve
And, like this insubstantial pageant faded,
Leave not a rack behind. They are such stuff
As dreams are made on, and their little life
Is rounded with a sleep.

Pound up - Market up - could it be that sense prevails and the markets accept a clean break from the EU is now on the cards? :-)

The one thing I think Fred and I most likely agree on, is TM must go.

Have they told Mrs Maybe to get on her bike and get back to little England yet?

A couple of paragraphs from John Stepek today. (Moneyweek)

The scenario that really scares the market

Firstly, there’s an increased risk of “no deal”. At the end of the day, financial markets would much prefer it if Britain had decided to stay in the European Union (EU) – which does, incidentally, go to show you why you can’t run a society by the dictates of financial markets alone, which is another reason for the current discord.

The fact that May can’t apparently get her deal through parliament suggests that the odds of “no deal” have risen. You can certainly argue that the odds on remaining have risen too – there’s now more chance of an election or a second referendum outcome. But it’s that increase in uncertainty that has helped to unnerve markets.

Secondly – and probably more importantly – there’s an increased chance of May getting kicked out. If May steps down or is forced to step down as prime minister, that increases the danger that Jeremy Corbyn gets his shot in the hot seat – and that’s what markets are really nervous about.

I realise it can sound as if I’m horribly biased against Corbyn, and I’ll make no bones about the fact that I think he’d be a disaster.

T May appears to me, to be on a political self-publicising tour of Europe at the expense of the British public in an attempt to save her own skin.

I think the costs and the abuse of the public purse should be investigated.

She appears manic and needing treatment rather than sympathy.

Europe is laughing and crying at the same time.

251,

JC a bigger disaster than May and her cohorts are already?

How many of the tory R.Wingers are holding their fund outside the UK?

Bring on the fairies.

only fred and his marxist buddies think of corbyn as JC ..... except belief in JC and his Dad are haram to true marxists

How many of the Labour Left Wingers are holding their fund outside the UK?

10729 - probably no more than those who claim allegiance to the labour party

'Chaos is complete': what the European papers say about Brexit

Commentators left bemused and frustrated at May’s move to delay vote on EU deal

Europe’s commentators have not been kind to Theresa May after she delayed the meaningful vote on her Brexit deal and dashed to the continent in search of further concessions.

“It’s like a long, slow agony,” wrote Sonia Delesalle-Stolper, the London correspondent for the French daily Libération. “You know the end is near, you expect the worst, then there’s a small flicker of light – before another collapse. And it always ends badly.”

May “blew her last bet”, failing miserably to convince parliament to vote for the withdrawal agreement sealed barely two weeks ago. “Rather than suffer the humiliation, she suspended the vote,” the paper said: “The latest plot twist in the infernal Brexit saga. Chaos is complete.”
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In the Netherlands, the Volkskrant wondered whether May would still be prime minister by the time the House of Commons got to vote on the deal: “Laughed out by MPs, called out by the Speaker, and on the way out according to her critics, May postponed the vote indefinitely to spare herself a humiliating loss.”

In Germany, Handelsblatt’s Carsten Volkery admired May’s “inexhaustible capacity for suffering and unique stamina”. But, the paper said, “what up until recently prompted respect in both friends and opponents, now increasingly sparks confusion and incomprehension”.

Parliament’s rejection of the deal shows “not only shows the complete powerlessness of the prime minister”, Handeslblatt said, but underlines the extent to which May “nurtured the illusions of the Brexit hardliners”.

Her attempt to seek concessions from the EU is doomed, because it “will not give May what she wants to satisfy her critics”. For Britain, it is not a good look: the prime minister “cannot be honest even at this late stage”, and too many MPs “continue to insist their full demands be met, rather than accept a necessary compromise”.

In Spain, El País editorial writer Iñaki Gabilondo said Britain was now “in the quagmire” after a referendum “that has not ceased delivering displeasure since the very moment it was born”.

Italy’s Corriere della Serra spoke of May’s “most difficult day … marked by open laughter and screams of mockery”, while Gaia Cesare, writing in Il Giornale, described May’s decision as a “desperate, last-minute move” designed to “save Brexit, the country and herself” that only “adds chaos to chaos”.

In Sweden, Therese Larsson Hultin, writing in Svenska Dagbladet, said May’s decision meant Britain had gone from “great uncertainty about Brexit, to complete chaos. For the simple truth is that no one, absolutely no one, knows what will happen until the British leave the union at midnight on 29 March next year.”

The prime minister may attempt to “seek help from the continent in the eleventh hour”, the paper said, “but the question is just how helpful her European colleagues can, and want, to be.”

Denmark’s Berlingske made the same point. “When exactly does the EU decide it’s had enough of rolling May’s Brexit rock up the mountain?” it asked. “And just what is the EU able – and willing – to do to help her once more?”

The one I liked was 'Brexit is like football - the Englsh always lose in the end'.

:o)

The odds of a 2nd referendum is shortening further, dear ruddy-faced gammon folks. It's about evens now.

And it's odds on that you won't be leaving at the end of March.

:o)

Typical Tories on here Fred, they believe most if not all of what the Gutter press spouts to them about trying to scare people with words like marxist etc.

how would you describe corbyn and his views then?
don't tell me he reminds me of your kind and cuddly uncle joe?

Brexit was 8/1 after the exit polls Hils and the first results had been announced.

And it's good to see that we are pissing the EU off for once instead of the other way round.

Apparently there's a way of delaying the vote past the 21st January , chuck in a Tory leadership contest after that and bingo ... 29th March.

Tic toc.

Could also tell Corby in Feb he can have a general election on April 4th if he wants one and dissolve Parliament.

Listening to Mays interview and her ducking of the question I think she's been told the letters are in and she faces a vote of no confidence.

Manuel,

I see Corbyn as a reasonable pragmatist with a respect for society and its needs as a whole, not just self-identifying with only one sphere of it and content to, or trying to advantage themselves at the expense of others.

Does he make mistakes?

Sure, but not to the same size, or as many of the mistakes that have been are being made by the present inept and inadequate oligarchy attempting to govern or misgoverning the UK at present.

Who seem to many observing to be self-serving, as were those in the previous tory government.

But I can see why they appeal to zealots like you often seem to me to be.

What will Corbyn be like as a PM?

Not certain, but his success may be by forming a collegiate type of cabinet or coalition and acting as a CEO making decisions and policy changes after advice, discussion and thought.

Also, perhaps, and I hope taking actions with awareness and attempts to consider the possible consequences of such actions.

It will be interesting to watch and observe what occurs if he becomes PM.

He doesn't listen to the sensible ones in his party now Fred and would like to see them deselected so what you want won't happen.