Will this increase or decrease the likelihood of terrorist actions in America, Europe and the rest of the world?

If you were a member of a family murdered in this conflict, would you be seeking revenge?

Should Tzipi Livni and Ehud Olmert, be tried for war crimes if or when this conflict comes to an end?

What will the price of oil be in 4 weeks time?

Sarkozy, a man who shows leadership with courage and common sense.

Can you imagine the reaction in Saudi or so many other Muslim states if western women walked around half naked? They would find that offensive to their religious, cultural and social mores. Fair enough, that's their country. Their business.

Why then do they think they can imprison "their" women in such clothing when it offends our cultural and social mores in this country? Our business.

And why do all those left liberal Israel haters condemn Israel when they want to keep their Jewish identity in their country. Up to them. Their business.

I'm all for real multi-culturalism where other groups, religions etc are tolerated and live together happily as long as what they do isn't offensive to the rest of the population. For example we in the UK should and do tolerate many other cultures and they often enrich our society - and most of those groups do it without causing offence.
Personally I have no problem whatsoever with Muslim women wearing head scarves, but full body coverage produces a sense of unease and alienation - just as it would if UK nationals walked around in Ku Klux Klan outfits.
Equally I have every sympathy with the populations of religious Muslim countries feeling that Christian missionaries trying to convert locals is offensive to them - very understandable.

If missionarys tried to convert people in Saudi, they'd be beheaded.
That is their law.

Interesting letter in the Times today.
I don't often paste second hand opinion, but here's one of the many moderate people whose views are often overlooked.

Sir, While I oppose Nicolas Sarkozys right-wing and pro-American agenda, I commend the French leader for questioning the validity of full-face veiling for Muslim women (report, June 23). The Muslim Educational Centre of Oxford (Meco) has championed the unequivocal right of Muslim women not to wear either the hijab (headscarf) or face covering (niqab/burka) in the light of pristine Koranic teachings.

For too long a foreign-inspired Muslim clergy that defends female inferiority and gender discrimination has subjected Muslims in the West to virulent indoctrination. This brainwashing stems from the Middle East and South Asia but has no Koranic foundation. It is propagated by nefarious factions, including the hardline Wahhabi-Ikwani-Salafi-

Deobandi sects. These currently ascendant sexist groups in Europe peddle the myth that full body covering and face concealment for women is a religious requirement. On the contrary, it is nothing more than a cultural choice, a personal preference. The mullahs fail to tell their flocks that nowhere in Islams transcendent text is there any mention of the word burka or niqab. Since the Koran declares itself to be immutable and that nothing has been omitted from the scripture (vi, 38), why is there a need for latterday misogynists to impose a draconian dress code that is not specifically sanctioned by the holy book? Other than calling for public modesty of both sexes, Islams sacred scripture does not prescribe any specific sartorial code.

As with everything else that brings Islam into disrepute today, the Muslim clergy relies on secondary sources, particularly the hadith (sayings of the Prophet Muhammad) to support their questionable theological views, including the need for women to hide their faces. But it is a historical fact that the hadith, many of which are suspect or spurious, were compiled about 250 years after the death of the Prophet. Clearly, where these human statements conflict with the divine text, they have no legitimacy.

While Muslim women should be at liberty to decide what to wear, they have to be truthful and say that they are upholding cultural mores and tribal traditions when they veil their faces. They cannot honestly claim that this trendy fad, which evokes understandable fear and negativity in European society, is a koranic imperative or a religious duty.

Only with the emergence of an indigenous British Islam that is faithful to the uplifting tenets of the faith in restoring the Korans total primacy will there be advances in the status of Muslim women in Britain. This naturalised Islam firmly rejects the fabrications and fallacies of a Saudi-funded clergy and will expedite effective Muslim integration into the British mainstream.

In the meantime, the French President should be applauded for initiating an essential public debate about the non-koranic burka and niqab.

Dr T. Hargey

Chairman, Muslim Educational Centre of Oxford

quite so, but it conveniently overlooks the fact that it is the men in islamic countries - and indeed most others - who set down what they consider their womenfolk should wear ...... indeed, that is even still the case in UK in many branches of (white) society.

Yes, there are even men in the UK who ask their women to go around the house naked.
Much more civilised here in the West.
Especially in Surrey.
;-)

Do you mean mini-skirts?

The Israeli Goverment must be proud of itself.

UN rights mission hears of Gaza children's suffering
GAZA CITY (AFP) A UN human rights mission listened to testimony about the suffering of children in the Gaza Strip on Monday before wrapping up two days of public hearings into alleged Israeli war crimes.
Around 20 percent of children in Gaza suffer from post-traumatic stress syndrome brought on by witnessing violent acts, child psychologist Dr Iyad Sarraj told the panel.
"The amount of killing and blood that they have seen or that their relatives have suffered from... it's a huge amount, and this leads to negative psychological feelings, to radicalism and a cycle of violence," he said.
More than half of Gaza's population of 1.5 million is under 18 years of age.
The public hearings are part of the UN Human Rights Council's investigation of the 22-day Israeli offensive launched in late December that killed about 1,400 Palestinians and 13 Israelis.
The Red Cross meanwhile said in a new report that six months after the devastating offensive Palestinians in the impoverished coastal territory are "unable to rebuild their lives and are sliding ever deeper into despair."
Israeli and Egyptian sanctions imposed on Gaza after Hamas seized power in June 2007 have crippled reconstruction efforts and caused widespread misery, according to the study by the International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC).
"The poorest residents in particular have exhausted their coping mechanisms and often have to sell off their belongings to be able to buy enough to eat," said Antoine Grand, head of the ICRC sub-delegation in Gaza.
"Worst affected are the children, who make up more than half of Gaza's population," he added.
The UN mission in Gaza is headed by Richard Goldstone, a South African judge who previously served as chief prosecutor for international criminal tribunals for the former Yugoslavia and Rwanda.
On Sunday, the mission heard a wheelchair-bound man describe how an Israeli shell slammed into his home, killing 11 of his relatives and cutting off his legs. Another man described a strike on a mosque that killed 17 people.
The group was expected to look into several allegations of human rights violations that emerged in the aftermath of the assault, which Israel said was aimed at stemming Palestinian rocket fire from the Hamas-ruled enclave.
Israeli authorities have so far refused to allow the investigators into the country and have accused the mission of bias against the Jewish state.
"The mandate is so one-sided, no fair, thinking person could see it as objective," government spokesman Mark Regev said on Sunday.
"The UN Human Rights Council has over the last months and years totally discredited itself as a serious vehicle for advancing human rights."
The 47-member council voted by a large majority in January to probe accusations of "grave" human rights violations by Israel, but the team was later given a broader mandate to deal with "all violations" during the war.
Israel has insisted it made every effort to spare civilians, including dropping thousands of fliers warning residents to flee ahead of strikes.
It has also said that Palestinian fighters and rocket launchers operated in crowded residential areas, a charge also lodged by human rights groups against the Islamist Hamas movement ruling Gaza.
The group plans to hold similar hearings in Geneva in which they will interview witnesses and experts on alleged violations in Israel and the occupied West Bank, and to issue a final report by September 12.
The international community has pledged billions of dollars in aid to rebuild the territory, but reconstruction efforts remain paralysed by the closures, which prevent the import of virtually all building materials.


http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20090629/wl_afp/mideastconflictgazaun_20090629142943

What American and British democracies have left behind after their invasion.

Worth a thought!

http://cosmos.bcst.yahoo.com/up/player/popup/?rn=3906861&cl=14218353&ch=4226714&src=news

In that case Hamas and other groups in Palestine must be even more proud:

Palestinian use of children barbaric



Typically one sided posting as ever Fred.

Isacsl Not my reporting.

Just world wide recognized reports.

I think the propaganda you have just shoveled seems to be old Israeli propaganda which the extreme Zionist groups want to portray all Arabs as being. Quite probably they believe it as well. Nobody, accepts the behavior shown in your clipping, but the majority of the sensible world also condemns the murder by the Israeli government's bombardment of Gaza, with killing of more than a thousand adults and children.
Nor do they condone the flouting of the United Nations and the seeming attempt to starve and torture the inhabitants who remain in Gaza. Stopping them from reconstruction of hospital facilities, public health, schools and structure necessary for a decent existence.

The present actions reminds me of the German actions in Poland, which I would have assumed and hoped you condemned!

The problem is that the Israeli actions get entrenched in the minds of the children of the families who have suffered. Their hatred will increase and eventual dealing with the problem more difficult.

and this thread will probably be dribbling and drivelling on until at least the next century

Cynic. Are you dribbling already? I have read that some of these conditions can be treated successfully now, so don't worry too much about your problems.

Fred - perhaps you should check the meaning of reporting and posting? Not be your reporting but it is you who keeps posting one side of the story only. BTW did you ever look at that video showing what Hamas does to its children? Just pretended you were too busy to look I seem to remember. I should be grateful that at least you found the time on your busy schedule to click on that link. Both sides are guilty of some not very nice things. I can't remember you condemning anything done by Hamas or other Palestine groups.

Isaacs, I can't recall you condemning Israeli action in Gaza, even though World opinion has done.

I have condemned "barbarity" carried out by whichever side of the conflict carries them out.

I have seen enough results of violence and carnage to have no need to indulge in watching more than I need to. If you wish to, so be it.

You certainly don't have to accept my opinions, but suggest you review the policy change being introduced by America and the statements recently made by Obama and Clinton about the Israeli actions in Gaza. I suppose you information and opinion is worth more than theirs. For you it may be, but I doubt that to be universally so.

I have been critical of Arab actions in the past and certainly dont like Islamic fundamentalism or dictatorships, preferring in general democracies with all the associated problems and weaknesses.

If you are suggesting I am critical of recent Israeli governments, you are correct and I think I am supported by the majority of World opinion. The news coverage also supports this positioning and opinion.

I am sorry that you are in the minority and that others with your opinions or similar may be blocking the peaceful, equitable and fair resolution of the Middle East problems.

I would suggest you take your head out of the sand and face up to the changes which are occurring.

If you have the time today Fred please go back over the thread and pull out any comments you've made condemning Hamas and Palestinian terrorist actions. You might even start by watching that video you overlooked.

What is wrong with being in a minority anyway? Sometimes the minority is right. Gordon Brown is in a minority (rapidly approaching a minority of one, well two if you include yourself) but you still think he is right.

Isaacs, I will leave the pleasure of reviewing this thread to you.

Again opinion of Brown gained from reports from abroad are not supportive of your opinion. Mind it is the propaganda that of some of the Tory rabble promote and believe. Read more widely while I await to see what occurs in the economy over the next 12mths. Also wait to see what policies the present labour government introduce.

Being in the minority, is fine as long as it doesn't allow you to dismiss reality. Sometimes, to me, you seem to, all to often.

Have a nice day.

Any thoughts that the UK economy has turned or is about to turn for the good should be quickly dispelled. The worst of it is still to come.

I predict there will be blood on the streets of the UK before things get better. If he isn't already, Gordon Brown is about to be the most hated man in Britain.

LOL reports from abroad. What about reports from here of the people who should have elected him and his bunch of cronies and who have to live with the results of his cock-ups every day? I can't believe you still think he is popular. Talk about denying reality.

I think he already is Hilary. Fred would give him a close run though if he was a politician.

Hiliary,

I thought you had packed your bags and were on your way to the ski escape.

Anyway, whose blood will be running when the mobs vent their frustration? ( I wonder if they will be singing;


Aux armes, citoyens,
Formez vos bataillons,
marchons !
Qu'un sang impur
Abreuve nos sillons !

Will it be the small time adventurers, the failed bankrupt bankers, or the businessmen, who will under the failing economic policies of Wisteria, (or lack of them) fall back on state aid. (Public taxation will go up.)

Rampant devaluation is on the screens.

This, when followed by inflation, is often considered to be a method of redistribution of wealth.

Small timers (sorry emigrants) with a bit of devaluing cash rushing to the borders of countries, which wont want them, hoping that they may be let in.

The outlook is gloriously horrendous. I glad my wife has bought for me, a small plot of land locally.

You never know it may happen.

Jesus, I have just look out of the window. How did Sputty and Mighty Mouse get there?