bosley
- 20 Feb 2004 09:34
kimoldfield
- 25 May 2006 19:11
- 17008 of 27111
Harwood27
Mm, yes on page 8 but not yet confirmed that Tesco will use Symphony. It has to be said that they are a good company and the sp is ripe for a punt, but I will stick with SEO; maybe a merger/takeover one day?
kim
kimoldfield
- 25 May 2006 19:13
- 17009 of 27111
There is, of course, a difference between degradable and biodegradable. Answers on a postcard.
kim
garyble
- 25 May 2006 19:32
- 17010 of 27111
Plastic bag issues in Australia
Posted May 23rd 2006 4:27PM by Andrew Barrow
Filed under: Business, Australia, Trends
I mentioned a few days ago the plan by UK supermarket Tescos to introduce bio-degradable carrier bags across the country. In Australia a similar plan has failed to produce the environmental benefits hoped for.

The Australian Government's economic advisory body has recommended ditching plans to wipe out their huge use of plastic bags (estimated ot be five billion plastic bags a year), saying the costs outweigh the benefits.
The idea to save marine wildlife and reduce litter was of course a good one but they say that plastic bags are not that great a threat to wildlife and that the authorities have not taken into account that bags are reused as bin liners. The commission argues that tougher anti-litter laws or harsher fines might be a better way of addressing litter.
The supermarket chains Woolworths and Coles have so far failed to meet a 50 per cent reduction target by the end of last year.
The image is from the BBC; an article on green issues.
garyble
- 25 May 2006 20:02
- 17011 of 27111
Also:
Tesco introduces biodegradable plastic carrier bags
December 10, 2003 The Tesco supermarket chain is to start using biodegradable plastic carrier bags following a six months pilot trial. The bags will be made using Environmental Products' technology from Canada in which proprietary TDPA (Totally Degradable Plastic Additives) are added to the PE or PP film during production to render it degradable and ultimately biodegradable in a suitable disposal environment such as landfill or in soil. Before disposal bags can be reused or recycled without degrading.
The TDPA technology - which is also licensed to Ciba Specialty Chemicals for worldwide agricultural applications under the brand name Envirocare - differs from that in other biodegradable films in that the additives can be added at the machine throat, generally at letdown ratios of 2 - 3 per cent, and work by accelerating the oxidation of the plastic. The reaction is triggered by heat or UV light, and enhanced by mechanical stress and moisture.
Once the plastic begins to oxidise it becomes brittle and susceptible to the usual agents of degradation, such as moisture and microbes. Oxidation can start in five or six weeks.
Other biodegradable plastics use organic starch additives which can be digested by micro-organisms, but leave the plastic molecules. The action of these additives is triggered by moisture, which EPI says leaves them open to unplanned degradation. The EPI oxo-biodegradation process is triggered by light, heat or stress, but, says EPI, occurs at a rate tailored to the buyer's requirements, breaking down over months or years.
The Tesco contract follows market development by EPI's former UK agent Symphony Plastics which earlier this year conducted trials with Tesco and Safeway on EPI-treated rubbish bags.
Symphony broke away from EPI during the summer to concentrate on its own d2w additive technology - although EPI claimed that it terminated the contract because Symphony had fallen short on its agreed uptake of EPI additives. Subsequently Symphony signed an agreement to supply its additives to a retailer in North America, and for a distributor to sell them in Brazil.
zscrooge
- 25 May 2006 20:22
- 17012 of 27111
Where's JJS?
EWRobson
- 25 May 2006 20:46
- 17013 of 27111
No doubt squelched! He wouldn't shut up of his own accord, would he?
Incidentally, having recorded my acquisition today, I wonder who else has averaged down?
Eric
bhunt1910
- 25 May 2006 21:27
- 17014 of 27111
Eric - I would love to join you - but fully committed in SEO and Chaco and MRP.
Actually - I need seo or chaco to rise just a tad tomorrow to get the cfd sharks off my back - those late buys in both seo and CHP are encouraging.
halfamil
- 25 May 2006 22:56
- 17015 of 27111
Great news. I wasn't even aware of this one. Can't understand the negative comments. MadPad?
This could be bigger than Frogpack!!!
driver
- 25 May 2006 23:33
- 17016 of 27111
Also on the bags from the Research Page, see Howard White's comment at the end.
37) France votes for ban on non-biodegradable bags
By Fiona Harvey in London
Published: October 14 2005 03:00 | Last updated: October 14 2005 03:00
Plastic bags could soon be passin France, following a vote by the national assembly to ban the use of non-biodegradable plastics in bags and packaging by 2010.
The bags have already become a rarer sight in the country, as a government initiative to reduce their use prompted a 20 per cent reduction in the number distributed in 2004.
France is following the example set by countries such as Ireland, which imposed a 15 cent (10p) levy on the bags in 2002, as well as South Africa, Rwanda and some Indian states, which have banned certain forms of bags.
In all these places, the number of bags used and found as litter dropped markedly.
Though plastic bags are routinely given out by supermarkets and shops, they do not naturally break down in the environment and can stay intact in landfill for an estimated 400 years. They also pose a threat to marine life and birds, which may choke on the bags or become trapped or entangled in them.
In the UK alone, shoppers use about 8bn plastic bags a year, the vast majority of which end up in landfill.
Forms of plastic bag that do break down in the environment have been available for years, but are not widely used because they are more expensive than conventional bags. However, the rising price of oil has made most forms of plastic dearer.
Howard White, managing director of Stanelco, which makes a biodegradable form of bag, said: "This is a way of being responsible to the environment while also saving millions of barrels of oil, and now is the time for action. Only legislation can make this happen."
In France, the ban has an extra dimension. The national assembly voted through the ban earlier this week as part of a series of measures on agriculture.
One green alternative to plastic made from petrochemicals is to make the bags from starch, which French legislators believe could provide a boost to the farming sector.
More countries may institute controls on plastic bags in the near future. In Germany, some legislators have been considering such a move, while a levy on the bags has been mooted by the Scottish National Executive
greekman
- 26 May 2006 08:12
- 17017 of 27111
The approximate number of plastic bags consumed this year:
199,040,903,303 .
If you go onto the link it will show you a running figure of plastic bags.
It's amazing how many we use by the minute.
http://www.degradable.net/
greekman
- 26 May 2006 08:20
- 17018 of 27111
In simple terms it appears degradable bags refers to plastic based with additives added to encourage degradation. Biogradeable appears to mean, made of total biodegradable substances, IE natural. ( Got a Z minus in science... bet you have never heard of that one....so any boffins out there, don't shoot me down ).
kimoldfield
- 26 May 2006 08:27
- 17019 of 27111
An A* for you GM!
kim
greekman
- 26 May 2006 08:30
- 17020 of 27111
Cheers
bhunt1910
- 26 May 2006 09:03
- 17021 of 27111
Greekman - if thats an approximate estimeate - I would hate to see what happens when you start providing accurate figures !!!!
Just for fun
oblomov
- 26 May 2006 09:27
- 17022 of 27111
The figure was wrong - I used one when no-one was watching!
greekman
- 26 May 2006 09:43
- 17023 of 27111
So would I.
garyble
- 26 May 2006 09:47
- 17024 of 27111
There appears to be some confusion and a few social barriers to overcome with regard to biobags:
http://www.naturalmatters.net/article.asp?article=418&cat=12
"
Biodegradable bags have been touted as the solution by some. Tesco's spokesperson informed me that all of its shopping bags will be biodegradable by the end of the year. These new bags will begin to degrade after just 60 days. No more unsightly bags flapping on overhead wires then. It sounds like the perfect solution but, again, INCPEN and Friends of the Earth are in agreement. "Biodegradable bags are made from polythene and starch," says Friends of the Earth. "When the bag is buried after being thrown away, the starch molecules in among the polythene are broken down by bacteria. The bag, therefore, disintegrates, but the polythene does not decompose. Some retailers use them to project a "green" image for their company"
It appears that certain key people need to be made aware of the differing biomaterials available as the perception appears to be that they're based on petro-plastics.
garyble
- 26 May 2006 10:10
- 17025 of 27111
Not sure if Tesco used the term "degradable" or "biodegradable" but as mentioned earlier there is a difference:
Degradable Bags
Bags that can be broken down by chemical or biological processes are described as degradable. Intuitively, degradable bags are expected to be environmentally friendly and a number of retailers are actively pursuing this option. Thus, there is often some surprise when reports suggest that degradable bags are not such an 'environmentally friendly' option. Waste management protocols emphasise the need to prevent, reduce, reuse, recycle and then recover energy. Encouraging disposal via degradation runs counter to this approach.
It can also be difficult to agree whether a particular type of bag is degradable or not. This could become significant if biodegradable bags were to be exempt from the levy.
Types of degradable bags
There are two main kinds of degradable bags 6.
Biodegradable bags are made from natural starch sources such as maize and synthetic polyesters that degrade through the enzymatic action of micro-organisms (bacteria, fungi and algae), essentially rotting down like vegetable matter. However, starch-based biodegradable carrier bags are not available in significant numbers in the UK. They would only be covered by a potential levy on plastic carrier bags if they contained some plastic (some do for bag-strengthening reasons).
Bioerodable bags are made from synthetic plastics (oil-based) with trace degradation initiators ( HDPE with an approximately 3% content of heavy metals such as manganese and iron 7) and, as such, would be covered by a plastic bags levy. They bioerode primarily by oxidation and erosion of the plastic through the action of light and heat until very small particles of plastic remain (these often degrade biologically). It is reported that, in an anaerobic environment, the degradation process is halted for some types of bioerodable bags [ RMIT, Symphony Plastic Technologies].
From:
http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Publications/2005/08/1993154/31585
greekman
- 26 May 2006 10:12
- 17026 of 27111
Garyble,
As I understand it some so called biodegradable bags do contain oil based products, but these are or should be called degradable bags. A true biodegradable bag should be made fron 100% natural sources.
This is taken from the BIOBAG web site.
BioBag is proud to be the best selling brand of certified 100% biodegradable and 100% compostable bags
No polyethylene is used in the production of BioBags.
BioBags will decompose in a controlled composting environment in 10-45 days, leaving no harmful residues behind.
Note the comment...No polyethylene, which I presume is similar the polythene.
So it appears some companies do stick to the rules, as I am sure SEO biodegradable products do.
garyble
- 26 May 2006 10:45
- 17027 of 27111
Greekman,
Agreed. The distinction is clear. There is the general term of "degradable" which covers both types. Then Biodegradable for those made from natural starches and synthetic polyesters, finally Bioerodable for those made from oil-based plastics with additives to promote breakdown.