for more information about stanelco click on the links.

driver's research page link
http://www.moneyam.com/InvestorsRoom/posts.php?tid=7681#lastread
website link
http://www.stanelco.co.uk/index.htm

tried that, but found the dog's a much better pundit .... clearly has some sort of 6th sense, whereas i have none

Fine.
I report, verbatim, a discussion between myself and a friend whom happens to work in a high profile role for Asda, and I get abused by an arse.
I shall very happily keep any further news to myself.
Those who have read these boards for any length of time will know that I have no axe to grind, and am a long term supporter of SEO.
Imbeciles will come up with ridiculous comments.
Eric, my friend was discussing the issues of sourcing cheap enough starch. This is coming from third world countries, to keep raw material costs low, and being transported to first world countries for production. This is where the high mileage comes in, not in transporting the finished product.
The GM issue is also covered by this as many GM trials are carried out in asian nations as their regulations are less rigorous.
Anyway. To the muppet. Take it or leave it. I really don't care.
To the rest of you, I will happily post news I may get hold of in the future.
Alan

You can borrow my cat any time Alan ;)

Alan
I wouldn't worry too much about Cynic, likes to post on lots of threads in an attempt to come across as someone who knows what he is talking about. However, it is painfully obvious that he does not, reminds me of a poster called Mufmitz on another board, perhaps they are related?
Err, and I've got three cats and you can have 'em all if you want and I'll throw in the dog as well.
pth

With regard to Alan's post number 17201, as we all should know Starpol is made by mixing PLA with TPS. PLA is made from corn starch, and is manufactured by Natureworks with whom Stanelco has got a supply agreement. Wal-Mart are using Natureworks' PLA. Stanelco have said that Starpol will be cheaper than the oil based plastic equivalent.
Therefore, according to Alan's friend, as the 3 question marks have been addressed as outlined above, Asda and Wal-Mart will be buying Starpol in huge quantities.
I look forward to the great news.

I remain cautiously optimistic ??

As to hewittalan6's post re the discussion with Asda employee. He readily states he can not substantiate the fact stated, so we can only go on belief or not.
The comments come over as sensible so to me I am taking it as genuine. Each to his own. The main point made is the travel distance of the corn starch. OK but as I see it not as big an environmental question as bringing oil thousands of miles. If this really does kick off, I can see the product being fully produced in a far nearer country to the corn producers than here. This will save on cost as although there will still be transport cost etc, the labor source cost will obviously be cheaper. Helping poorer countries with jobs goes down well in this modern society. As to Walmart wanting a thorough look at Starpol prior to spending millions of dollars, it makes sense even after the Asda trials although they obviously wont start from zero.

Thanks for your post ALAN.
Made interesting reading.
Frankly , having read it asnd mulled it over, I don't see anything that can't be overcome /addressed in the very short term by processes/expectations already implied such as local sources for starch and MMP's.
If as is suggested COST is the overriding factor and STARPOL/GREENSEAL is cheaper than plastic etc (Production wise) then its a winner and should be taken up in due course. A little GREEN is better than corporate grey.#
That jam tommorrow sure looks good. lol

At last. Sensible responses.
The conversation made perfect sense to me.
If I was chairman at WM I would hardly change an entire supply and spend millions advertising my green credentials only for some jumped up little tree hugging bog dweller to pop up on a tv show and wreck it with comments about exploitation, aero fuel and genetic modification. I would want to be certain my green case was watertight. Wouldn't you???

from carclo's results today.

Soluble capsules

Our joint project with Stanelco to develop injection moulded capsules for
controlled release drug delivery has also made good progress. We now have a
committed launch customer and, on completion of the regulatory approvals early
next year, the capsules will be commercially launched in the veterinary market.
We continue to seek a partner for the human application of this technology.
These products can be viewed on the Carclo web site
www.carclo-plc.com
. Through
this project we have learned a great deal about how to overcome the moulding
issues with soluble polymers and in particular with Stanelco's Starpol 10/50. We
are confident that more product applications will develop around these new
thermoplastic materials.

seo are only one of a number of businesses that are pitching to walmart. that shouldn't be forgotten.

My information is that the green packaging agenda has been pitched for at least 4 and a half years.
On the plus side, this means that the SEO 1 year looks more reasonable and less of a management cock up by SEO. 1 year is also, apparantly, longer than others have stayed the course, but does reinforce boz's comments that SEO are not on their own.

Thanks for the post Alan and passing on your friends opinion. A good piece of information which I think has to be taken in context to what a 'senior' buyer is likely to know at this stage.

A couple of points.

1)I'm pretty sure that WM are on record as saying they would pursue the 'green route' even if cost was higher. Dont have time at present to locate the 'quote', perhaps someone will have it to hand.

2) Take the point that WM would be involved at ASDA if a major packaging change was to take place, however, irrespective of this, we have it on record that WM are trialling STARPOL themselves in the states. Again, would normally post the source, dont have time at present.

3) Issues regarding the transportation of raw materials will exist whatever material is used. I can see no reason to suggest that the existing materials used have advantages in this respect. The U.S. imports oil in huge quantities. It has the capacity to grow the corn, it doesn't need to import it. In the case of the U.K., the present oil-based materials must also travel a huge amount - the materials wont be made from North Sea oil.

I have no doubt that if Alan has posted this that the source is reliable, but wonder how much a senior buyer would know.

I would imagine that on a need to know basis, he wouldn't actually know much yet. 'Senior buyers' can change jobs - maybe at a months notice. WM are not going to be discussing this with him or other staff at his level at the risk he could be working for , say, Sainsbury's next month! He will be kept as the proverbial mushroom, no need for him to know anything.

He has given his opinion and although he is an employee of ASDA I dont see that his opinion is any more valid or fact based than the opinion of anyone, employed by ASDA or not, who isn't actually involved at a high level in the decision making at ASDA/WM .

I would imagine he knows less about all this than most of us. If it wasn't for his ASDA connection, i.e. if he were a new poster making the points that he has , I'm sure most of us would quickly disregard what he was saying.

One further point to add to the above - the question of GM free.

The U.S. is largely in favour of GM crops, this would not be an issue in the States.

For example, see:-

http://www.guardian.co.uk/comment/story/0,,1708257,00.html

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article11896.htm

I really wish I could give more details of my friends function and responsibilities but he was very forthcoming about this up to the point I told him of my interest in SEO. He kinda clammed up a bit then, and made me promise not to reveal who he is!!
Let me just point out that, for instance, the fresh fruit buying team do not buy from fruit growers. They buy from fruit packagers and agree the packaging and display of the items. They do not order a billion apples from orchards. The sourcing of the contents is down to the packager.
This leads me to understand that he is more involved in packaging and presentation than you may think.
I cannot tell you any more about his position as he is a very necessary part of my cricket team, and I would hate to lose his confidence or his bowling abilities!!
Take it however you all wish, guys, but I cannot emphasise enough this guys seniority at Asda, and if you knew the pains Asda went to to employ him, you would understand. If I named him, you would take his comments very seriously indeed.
He did not say though (before I am accused of bashing) that the problems are insurmountable, just that they would have to be overcome for any significant orders to be placed. He gave me no idea on timescale or likely success and no further info other than the problems with my batting technique (cheeky git).
He also told me a very interesting point about the relationship between McDonalds and Coca Cola, and where that is about to head, but thereby hangs another tale!!!
Alan

Oblo,
While GM is not an issue in the US, WM are hell bent on world domination and it is everywhere else. The direction of food retailing is very firmly towards organic, natural, environmental and fair trade. WM are big enough to swim against the tide, but yearn to be seen as everyones friend.
In the states, apparantly, they are the most hated corporation. Given that the states include McDonalds, Disney and Microsoft, that takes some doing!

Come on Alan

You cannot make that statement in your last sentence and leave us all hanging and swinging in the wind! Unless, of course, you are being deliberately provocative.

Spill the beans about Coke and McD.

The oily one

Bosley, thanks for the info from Carclo, a timely reminder of one of the other many strings to SEO's bow.
Alan, many thanks for your report, I actually find it encouraging! It sets out a good reason for delay in forming a contract; as I have said before, WM are not going to make a decision until EVERYTHING is right, no matter how small, they have a very tarnished reputation and will do anything to put a bit of polish on it. As for your contact, it seems to me that you now have a bit of a hold on him, maybe you can get him to put in a bit more practise at the nets!
kim

Good post Alan ,dont take any notice of the children.My major problem with bioplastics is the same as electric cars.The latter would be fine if the electricity was produced by a dedicated renewable source but more than likely comes from a fossil fuel burning power station so what with transmission costs etc added the car probably does more harm to the enviroment than a small petrol saloon.As for growing of corn this uses huge amounts of fossil fuels,ploughing,spraying,fertilising,the production and transport of the fertiliser,harvesting,more transporting,probably drying,transport to end user, and thats before we even start with the production of the bioplastic which certainly wont be done with a water wheel.So the question I am posing is are bioplastics really as enviromentally friendly as people say?

No great secret, Oblo.
Coca Cola had done some research, many years ago, that showed they were the cola of choice among the 35+ generstion , but a long way behind Pepsi in the younger market.
Coca Cola decided that it would be a dying brand if the trend continued and addressed it by contracting that if McDonalds payed for the transportation and packaging, they could have their Coca Cola free of charge, in order to brainwash a generation of children into asking for Coca Cola, not Pepsi. It worked and while the drink is no longer absolutley free to McDonalds, the trading terms are a loss leader for Coca Cola and a massive cash cow for McDonalds. Coca Cola now believe that the balance of power between the two has changed and are addressing the issue of this particualr agreement as we speak. A real clash of the titans!!!
Alan