Fins have from today increased spreads by a factor of 3 on certain stocks.

When questioned as to why they have done this they are saying they do not want this business, it is not attractive to them i.e. they lose money and the punters win!

This is an absolute disgrace.

I only trade a couple of stocks this this account (which is quite small) but this just goes to prove that even if you can get past the constant sh*t they throw at you and make a profit they f*** you by hammering the spread.

Direct access will drive these crooks out of business and they only have themselves to blame. I always thought FINS were a bit different but no, true colours. This puts them on a par with the other biggest crook IG.

Avoid.

Mr Euro
You seem to have made the basic error of not understanding that ALL financial products are there to make the vendor rich and NOT the punter. Punters get rich in spite of vendors, not because of vendors.

They have always been a bunch of cowboys Mr E . There were a few good threads about them on a rival board.

Thats the problem with spread betting firms, in the terms and conditions they basically say the can change what they want when they like, with virtually no notice to the client. I used to like Fins a lot as there customer service was better than the rest, platform was easy to use etc, but only use them occasionally now.

Last year I think it was the day after the 4th of July US holiday, a Friday which was probably a 1/2 day if i remember right the bears stayed in the Hamptons for a long w/e, so the Dow decided to go straight up like a rocket, 400 pt gain or something like that, D4F crapped themselves and doubled the spread on the DOW from 4 at that time it was, up to 8 and kept it there for days as the bears came back Monday and smacked it straight down again, eventually they reduced to 5 as it is now.

Even now on shares like EBAY, MMM, IBM, your never sure what the spread is going to be. Where as GD has gone from about $50 a few months back to a high of about $80 recently with a 5pt spread, probably not as heavily traded with them as the other 3 are.

As for the other spread betting firms, I have never tried them, took one look at the spreads and thought sod that, although have not had a look for a while.

my own opinion Spread betting it can damage your pocket and life if not careful...not a supporter of it, but my Barrister freind tells me serious horror stories and can only say ...DONT SPREADBET...!

unless you want to mess with these crooks...because that is what they are...

just our opinion..

jules..

Now come on Jules it is unreasonable to denigrate this type of trading out of hand.

I use IG Index and I nearly included the word "REGULARLY". They are certainly not a firm of crooks and I have always found their service first class. I even visited them a spent a day in their office. Interestingly, they believe every investor (gambler if you want) will give back his profits over a period of time. I have found it vital to resist trading this market on a daily basis

The point is you are not careful you can find yourself trading the various markets, equities or indices, to make a 5-tick profit. If you do this you will play into the hands of the spread betting companies. A little success is very dangerous and you can very quickly find yourself being drawn into daily trades just to make, what you hope will be, a few quick bucks.

I have found that the way to us them is to wait until you are convinced that whatever you are trading is on the point of making a breakout and by that I am looking to make 50 points on indices and a minimum of 10% on a share price movement. After all it is no different to buying or selling a stock when you think it will rise or fall.

I am quite prepared to give a little away in the spread to make capital gains free profits. So far this year I am well on side but I do keep to tight stop-loss limits.

Regards
SAMPO

Your points taken well sampo my freind...maybe one day I'll have a flutter...

My next big hunch is RTD shares, is they fair well in next couple of weeks after results then I'll spread bet with my hearts content...

prefer to be safe at present..

good luck.
cheers...

jules99

"my Barrister freind tells me serious horror stories"

interested to know as to what kind of stories

thanks

jules99,

So would I!

at least 2 blokes had to sell and lose their homes after incurring huge losses..!

hope tht helps..ouch!

jules,

Those two blokes should have learned to manage their risk a little better!

ouch

i thought it was something with the sb's playing dirty tricks to get a few big ones over on their customers

what you mentioned is really down to the 2 guys risk management

Giving customers huge credit, can be deceiving if not understood...dirty tricks are always included trying to lure you into buying unwanted stock, or when trying to sell out, SB's saying they cant get through or dont have a buyer etc...which can all equate to losses, thankfully I am not in the game...phewwww!!!

jules.

I don't understand why anyone would trade short-term via the sb's - the 'house' advantage is not only enormous, there's also zero transparency so therefore you might as well blow your wad in casino - at least you'll get free food & drink! I've got 5 sb accounts, which I have barely touched since I opened my broker accounts and I can't see that ever changing, with the exception of long term position trades.

Too right velocity...

Advertising should go like this...

PUNTERS BEWARE - Spread Betting can dangerouslly damage your wealth and Health...

good luck.
jules.

Seems to me that the calculation is simple - if you expect that your profit from the deal after the SB spread will be &gt 60% of the profit from a CFD, use the SB, provided your annual profits exceed the CGT limit

For example, if the SB has GSK @ say 1215/1222 against an underlying of 1218/1220, then if the CFD firm let you deal at the cash price, a short on the spreadbet will be more profitable once the SB price goes to (say) 1205/1207 - a drop of 10 points - at that point the SB price is around 1203/1209 - making a (tax free) profit of just under 7 points. The CFD price is 1205/1207, giving a taxed profit of 8 points, or 6.6 points after paying 40% CGT (always assuming you make over the CGT threshold).

I appreciate what you are saying zzaxx99, but that is a holistic approach - the reality is that cfd's track the underlying cash prices and spreads extremely closely, whereas the sb's play tricks opening up the spreads, skewing the prices and actively trading against you. They too track the underlying cash (and when I say 'track' I mean very loosely) but how on earth can a skilled and disciplined short term trader consistently execute his/her trading plan when the probabilities are so stacked against them?
Assume that each trade is a 50:50 bet on the market at cash. Fine, if it's at cash. SB it and the combination punch of the abovementioned points stack the odds so heavily against you that you will lose your money more than 50% of the time because you will get stopped out when 'cash' wouldn't have stopped you out (ie it didn't trade at that price on cash, but the sb skew did!). And obviously that's not limited to stops - how about OCO's, limit orders, MIT, MOC etc etc. Also, spikes (& gaps) are more common & more extreme in the extent of their moves.

Surely successful trading is about control, and imho that is precisely what you are sacrificing if you are short term trading with the sb's.

deal for free are the boys.good spreads and good service.they do make mistakes
though therefore keep detailed records of trades(i only trade on the phone)

Can name your top CFD brokers...?

i am a spreadbetter and was about to open an account with fins, but after your timely comment I am going to avoid them like the plague.We the traders keep them in business we can also bring them down.
can you recommend me some decent spread betting firms
please email me
zarif_virmani@hotmail.com

-- Velocity,

From what I hear, deal4free skew their prices far more than Fins do, so you're not just trying to beat the additional spread on the SB account, you're trying to second-guess the pricing mechanism of the dealer as well. Dunno if other CFD types do this.

Take your point about the variety of automated trades - Fins is particularly bad for this - their online stop mechanism sometimes doesn't let you add stops, for no readily obvious reason. For example, my last threee trades in GSK - 1st one allowed them online, 2nd didn't allow it and I placed them by phone, the 3rd didn't allow, I went without stops and lived to regret it :-(