Thought Id start this one going because its rather dead on this board at the moment and I suppose all my usual muckers are either at the Stella tennis event watching Dim Tim (lose again) or at Henly Regatta eating cucumber sandwiches (they wish,...NOT).

Anyway please feel free to just talk to yourself blast away and let it go on any company or subject you wish. Just wish Id thought of this one before.

cheers GF.

Yahoo have done an any online poll. The question was 'did Margaret Thatcher change Britain for better or worse'. The result was interesting. 53% voted for better and 47% for worse.

Or die of sclerosis of the liver before they attain the age of 25yrs. Hopefully not and good luck to them.

Cynic,
Posting 23156,
It is a ludicrous attempt to give the rent recipient the responsibility of dealing with money.
In some cases like giving £50 pocket money to a six year old in a sweet shop and telling then not to spend any money.
May work sometimes.
-------------

Doodle bugs.

Do you know personally those who were demonstrating, or basing your opinion on periods of your own method of self expression?
Perhaps, they were irritated by the sycophantic expressions and eulogising of somebody saw as a tragedy in motion.

Greek,
Support cut off for 3rd and 4th child, means that the support is reduced for all the children or for the last number.
I suppose you could put them on the scrap heaps to die, as was done in ancient Rome. (That would teach them a lesson.)

Mind to keep the population at a sufficient level of replacement “needs”, one would have to asked the inbred elite to increase their breeding, or there wouldn’t be sufficient to look after in their old age.
-----------------------------
Your joke about the Abbot was beautiful.

Cynic,

Would you do 16 hours of work foe £56. Your are out of touch with the minimum wage.

Cynic,
One of the major problems with the decrying of the workless, is where are all the jobs,
Unemployed physically fit individuals should probably be expected to do some work in society, if they are able to, but working is not a virtue in itself and although I enjoyed what I did, there are many necessary occupations which I would have considered drudgery or punishment if i was expected to do.

Get the jobs, and certain jobs should be shared out amongst all in society, similar to being in a Kibbutz. It may bring back a respect of some to those carrying out more menial tasks than their own.
-----------------------------------------------------------
GF,
God help us, but the G was made of copper.

Cynic,
Eat your heart out, I have just found a case of 1963 Taylors port, which I was given back in the 70s.

Must have another look around.


Could drink it after the pork to-night.

Here is food for thought and for Hays a pointer to the confidence in Maggie's legacy:


Worried about the Euro? Buy Canadian Dollars

---------
Name Buy/Sell Date Trade Value Director Volume / Price
Amlin
Sell 08-Apr-13 £1,782,407.57 Charles E L Philipps 427,949 @ 416.50p
Hargreaves Lansdown
Sell 08-Apr-13 £1,633,719.27 Ian Gorham 192,372 @ 849.25p
Beazley
Sell 08-Apr-13 £372,713.10 Jonathan Gray 177,145 @ 210.40p
Vitec Group
Sell 08-Apr-13 £328,936.35 Stephen Bird 51,801 @ 635.00p
Beazley
Sell 08-Apr-13 £310,594.60 Martin Bride 147,621 @ 210.40p
Beazley
Sell 08-Apr-13 £304,202.65 Andrew Horton 144,583 @ 210.40p
Amec
Sell 08-Apr-13 £301,166.57 Ian P McHoul 28,628 @ 1,052.00p
Amlin
Sell 08-Apr-13 £269,408.86 Richard A Hextall 64,684 @ 416.50p
Amec
Sell 08-Apr-13 £230,545.81 Samir Brikho 21,915 @ 1,052.00p
Anite
Sell 08-Apr-13 £217,288.14 Christopher Humphrey 188,628 @ 115.19p
Beazley
Sell 08-Apr-13 £210,400.01 Martin Bride 100,000 @ 210.40p
Fisher (James) & Sons
Sell 08-Apr-13 £202,816.75 Nick Henry 19,787 @ 1,025.00p
Vitec Group
Sell 08-Apr-13 £195,536.36 Stephen Bird 30,493 @ 641.25p
Beazley
Sell 08-Apr-13 £175,791.31 Neil Maidment 83,551 @ 210.40p
Costain Group
Sell 08-Apr-13 £105,845.80 Andrew Wyllie 38,368 @ 275.87p

hmm! actually oxbridge is not necessarily the place to go ..... in fact, my youngest was well-served by not getting into balliol, going instead to nottingham, where his degree was much better tailored to his chosen area in the real world

though sophisticated adults may appreciate Quatr' Saisons and that ilk, i feel it rather distasteful to waste it on precocious teenagers, more than anything, because they will just not appreciate it

i know that may appear slightly hypocritical and certainly sticky's politics of jealousy, verging on inverted snobbery, cut no ice with me ..... everyone gets dealt a hand at birth, and as they progress through life, it is up to them how they make best use of that

btw, i'm afraid i know of far too many who have been through really good educational establishments and fallen badly off the rails .... more importantly, private education does not necessarily bring out the best results, academic and otherwise

I am told that my children have better tastes than I have and my eldest daughter reminds me that when she was six she used to escort me to an Italian restaurants on a regular basis and enjoyed the food. Those were the days,

Ooops have I lost the plot here - why would a 6yr old be escorting her Father to a restaurant - (Italian or Not)???? Very strange, it should be the other way around!!!!! Hope you daughter is only making a joke of it, pretending she used to take you fred.....

Would you do 16 hours of work for £56. Your are out of touch with the minimum wage. .... i confess i made a couple false assumptions .....

1) that the recipient was also getting full housing benefit (£500 pm i think)
2) that the £56 was like £75-90 for you and i who pay tax and nics etc

if 2 was correct, than £56 nett surely would equate to about £90 gross = pretty much minimum wage

==========

i confess i don't much care if the recipient gets the job of his life ..... tough fact, but most people are pretty bored at best with their employment - though decent management can make it more palatable

the real issue is that the recipient of benefits should get back into employment pdq .... apart from anything else, he is then in a stronger position when applying for another job ..... one would hope that he also derives some personal satisfaction from going at least some way to paying his way in life - as in many or even most ways, is our obligation

It wasn't a restaurant that they went to.

It doesn't matter what the hourly rate is for work while on benefits. The rile could be a full week's work for whatever you get. It isn't really pay anyway.

Right back from the sauna, them Turkish guys really are efficient hard workers show our supposed strivers a thing or two in the work stakes.

Had a lovely meal afterwards at the Yorkshire Ritz, 5 course, succulent baby venison for the main course.....ohh so yummy....... delicious.

"Ive worked for the DHSS I know what people with nothing to lose are capable of. They are desperate and will stop at nothing believe me.

Lets face it only 20 months ago we had RIOTS on the streets and the situation boiling up now is far worse.

Can you deny that?."

The middle class 'rioters' revealed: The millionaire's daughter, the aspiring musician and the organic chef all in the dock

Poverty, social exclusion, poor education - these are just some of the theories put forward to explain the recent rioting.

Yet shockingly, among those in the dock accused of looting are a millionaire's grammar school daughter, a ballet student and an organic chef.
A law student, university graduate, a musician and an opera steward also said to have taken part.

They are just some of the youngsters from comfortable middle-class backgrounds who have been charged with criminality.
Some of them were arrested at the scene, others handed themselves in after seeing their faces in photographs and on video.

You are such a total wind-up merchant gf - I'm surprised anyone falls for your nonsense any more.

Expect a lot more of this............


Tuesday, 9 April 2013


Conservative member of 50 years defects to UKIP ahead of county council elections

A CONSERVATIVE member of more than 50 years has defected to UKIP and will now stand against his former party in May’s county council elections.




Harry Carr, 72, a former Tory district councillor, made up his mind to leave the party before Christmas and will now contest the newly created Stroud Central ward for Nigel Farage’s anti-EU party next month.




Mr Carr, who joined the Conservatives as a 16-year-old after leaving school, said he was ‘totally dissatisfied’ with the party’s policies and its leader David Cameron, who he said ‘changes his mind every two months’.




At a national level, Mr Carr said he was unhappy with his party’s stance on Europe and uncomfortable with welfare reforms which were ‘taking money off disabled people’.




He also criticised Gloucestershire County Council’s Conservative administration for signing a contract with Urbaser Balfour Beatty for the Javelin Park incinerator before planning permission had been awarded.




"All those years I was a Conservative but I’ve just become totally dissatisfied," he said.




"There are a lot of Conservatives turning to UKIP at the moment. Their politics are very honest, very straightforward and they do exactly what they say on the tin."




Debbie Young, the Conservative Party candidate for Stroud Central, said: "One of the reasons why Harry has jumped ship to UKIP is because he wasn’t selected for the seat which I’m standing in so it is a shame really.




"We all have disagreements with our party both locally and nationally but sometimes you just have to swallow it.




"Just like any Labour Party member I would never say I agreed with every single thing my party did. I was outspoken about the incinerator at the district council, for example, but the Conservatives are still my political party."




Mr Carr and Cllr Young will also be standing against the current Green Party councillor, Sarah Lunnon, Labour's Tosca Cabello-Watson, and Adrian Walker-Smith of the Liberal Democrats in the elections on May 2.

http://www.bloggers4ukip.org.uk/2013/04/conservative-member-of-50-years-defects.html

An interesting read - particularly "Who was Involved".

The August riots in England Understanding the involvement of young people

Spot on Skinny just goes to show how the young and students of this country are totaly fed up with the tory party.

The derision shows no class barriers amongst the young.

The true FACTS about Thatchers reign not the right wing myths peddled here over the last 2 days.


Tuesday 09 Apr 2013

FactCheck: the Thatcher myths



As the nation looks back at the legacy of the Thatcher era, FactCheck separates fact from fiction.

Thatcher the milk snatcher

The nickname was coined by Labour in opposition and the press after the government abolished free school milk for over-sevens in 1970 when Margaret Thatcher was education secretary.



But according to her memoirs and archives, Lady Thatcher herself had argued in cabinet against getting rid of free milk altogether. It was a policy driven by the Treasury, first under Iain Macleod, then Anthony Barber.

So in Barber’s first budget of October 1970, the policy was limited to children above the age of seven, and special schools and children with medical needs were excluded.

She was an arch-eurosceptic

It certainly wasn’t always that way.

During the 1975 referendum on whether the UK should remain in the EEC, this was her opening gambit as she launched the Conservative campaign: “I welcome this opportunity to launch the Conservative campaign to keep Britain in Europe.”

In 1978, while still in opposition, she called for consideration of a common European approach to defence, and criticised the Labour government for failing to sign up to the exchange rate mechanism.

In 1986, she signed the single European act, which set a deadline of 1992 for the full completion of the single market to allow the free movement of goods, capital and people within Europe.



She had, however, fought for Britain’s position in Europe. In 1984, Thatcher threatened to stop payments to Europe unless the UK won its rebate – the “We want our money back” moment often misquoted as “I want my money back” .

Her position became more entrenched,culminating in the Bruges speech of 1988 in which she criticised an apparent “European super-state exercising a new dominance from Brussels”.

She took a hard line with the IRA

Thatcher was known for her uncompromising position on the IRA and the Maze prison hunger strikers in 1981. Ten men – seven IRA and three Irish National Liberation Army members - died during a campaign to secure political status for republican prisoners. Thatcher refused to budge as the men starved themselves to death, one by one.

But files of cabinet discussions released under the 30-year rule reveal that she negotiated directly with the republican leadership in an apparent attempt to resolve the crisis, and she considered whether compulsory “intravenous feeding” could be used to keep prisoners alive.

Messages were sent between MI6 and the IRA, with details concessions on clothing, parcels and visits the government would offer if the strike was called off.

One note appeared to carry Thatcher’s distinctive handwritten alterations. The following day, the Northern Ireland secretary, Humphrey Atkins, confirmed that she had approved the messages.

The economy boomed

Only for a while. In the late 1980s GDP growth was topping 5 per cent. But the Thatcher era was book-ended by two recessions, from 1980 to 1981 and from 1990 to 1991.

Annual GDP growth averages out at about 2.3 per cent over the whole of Baroness Thatcher’s time in office compared to 2.5 per cent under Tony Blair.



She destroyed the welfare state

Wrong again.

Persistent high unemployment was part of the reason why total spending on benefits rose from £53bn in today’s prices in 1979/80 to £77bn in 1990/91.

Public spending overall went up in cash terms every year under Lady Thatcher, generally keeping up with inflation. In 1982/83 the government was spending 48 per cent of GDP, more than in any year under Blair or Brown.

Spending had fallen dramatically as a share of GDP by the late 80s, but that was mainly because the economy grew quickly, not because spending was cut.

She cut taxes

No. She did lower taxes for the rich – lowering the top rate from 83 per cent to 60 then 40 per cent. But that was offset by a rise in VAT from 8 to 15 per cent.

Total tax and national insurance receipts as a percentage of GDP were actually slightly higher in 1989/90 than in 1979/80: 35 per cent rather than 33.7.

She destroyed manufacturing

The Thatcher era certainly saw de-industrialisation, but that process began before she became prime minister and accelerated under Blair and Brown.

Manufacturing output fell from 25 per cent of the economy in 1980 to 23 per cent in 1990.



The decline was much faster under Labour – manufacturing fell from 17 per cent of the economy to just 11 per cent between 2000 and 2010.

Most advanced economies have experienced a similar decline in manufacturing as a share of GDP.

The poor got poorer

It depends what you mean by “poor”.

The gap between rich and poor certainly got wider. Relative poverty and earnings inequality went up under Lady Thatcher.



That doesn’t mean the poor actually lost money, it’s just that the top earners did considerably better - a point Lady Thatcher made forcefully in her last appearance at the Commons dispatch box.

Median earnings went up faster than under John Major or in Labour’s second and third terms, according to the Institute for Fiscal Studies.



And while wages among the very lowest earners didn’t increase as fast as the top earners, they did go up too, according to Treasury data.

Of course we have to remember your wages could only go up if you had a job. Unemployment reached 3.2 million in 1984, a rate of 11.8 per cent – both record highs

http://blogs.channel4.com/factcheck/factcheck-the-thatcher-myths/13236

Now this is a CORKER OF A FACT and eye opener............

Public spending overall went up in cash terms every year under Lady Thatcher, generally keeping up with inflation. In 1982/83 the government was spending 48 per cent of GDP, more than in any year under Blair or Brown.

YES INCLUDING BROWN.

Right off to feed the trout, I hate them pellets and then watching 2nd half of Madrid match.

When I was growing up in this country we didn't need to have all these statistics and surveys about why young people behaved badly. I was given a good smack on my backside if I put a toe out of line. Too many parents today pass the responsibility of bringing up their children on to teachers or child minders. One of my friends recently went on a holiday cruise with her husband and said their holiday was completely ruined because children were running up and down the corridors outside their bedroom door late at night while their parents were getting pissed at the bar. No "class barriers amongst the young" gf and you have a huge class barrier chip on your shoulder for whatever reason.