Thought I'd start a new thread as this is going to be a major talking point this year...have not made up my mind yet...(unlike bucksfizz)....but thinking of voting for an exit as Europe is not doing Britain any good at all it seems....

Odds on betfair have tightened over the last week on leaving :

Remain out from 1.34 to 1.44
Leave in from 3.95 to 3.25

Betfair is probably the best indicator of average odds across the industry.

the report that parliament may well ignore the result if it's "out" will only reinforce the "out" vote

it's not really anything to do with personalities, but i think the voting public will be very angry indeed if the result is perceived to be irrelevant

You must Vote to leave the EU or wake up with the worst hangover in history

By
Boris Johnson


5 June 2016 • 9:00pm



http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06/05/you-must-vote-to-leave-the-eu-or-wake-up-with-the-worst-hangover/

Imagine waking up to Boris.

Looks like the market is warming to the prospect of Brexit.
2517

Jean-Claude Juncker drunk

http://order-order.com/2016/06/04/drunk-again-juncker-happy-slapping-eu-leaders/

What an embarrassment, disgraceful behaviour, especially from someone in such a prominent position. Is it any wonder these irks have steered the EU into troubled waters
2517

If it had been cameron being greeted, instead of been slapped and kissed,
junker would've bent him over and rode him like a squeeling pig.

Yes, but dave would like it.

Nicked from across the road:



SHARED POST: For the still unsure amongst us.

There seems to be a lot of misunderstanding about June 23rd, and people want to know the facts. Here are some:

You are not voting to leave the EEA or WTO, meaning all of the UK's trade and benefit agreements will remain unchanged should we leave, until such a time that the UK decides to renegotiate them for any reason.

You are not voting to leave NATO, meaning our security agreements remain unchanged. Should we receive an act of hostility from a non-NATO member, then NATO countries are obliged to come to our assistance. This does not change.

You are not voting to leave the UN, G8 or G20, meaning Britain will have the same voice on the world stage as it does today.

You are not voting to leave Europe!! The UK will still, geographically, be part of Europe. Non political organisations aligned to Europe will still extend membership to the UK (I.e. sports governing bodies, and so on).

You are not voting to stop recognising Interpol, Europol and neither are you voting for SIS / MI6 to stop dealing with other intelligence services in the fight against terrorism and global, organised crime.

You are not voting against being able to travel to Europe, contrary to the belief of some fools recently on TV. The UK has always maintained stricter border and passport controls than many EU members. This will not change. You will still use a passport to go on holiday and you will still be allowed entry to countries in Europe. You may even get chance to skip queues by using the non--EU queues at the airport (the only point so far that is my opinion, and not necessarily a fact).

The UK economy will benefit to the tune of £billions in the first year after we leave.

Medical and science research will not simply stop. The UK pays into the EU to then get money back in the form of funding. The UK will now be in control of this money and can choose to fund whatever UK based medical, science, art or other research it chooses.

Farming will not lose money because of EU funding being cut. The UK negotiated a rebate of some monies that the UK pays to the EU, in order to subsidise UK farmers. Instead of asking for our money back, we can give it straight to farmers. No change there.

You are not voting against human rights. The EU Convention on, and European Court of Human Rights are not part of the EU. Until parliament passes a new bill of rights for the UK, these will still apply, as will precedents already passed down to UK courts from Brussels.

You are not voting to kick anyone out of the UK or block access to anyone. Neither are you voting to stop recruiting valuable European workers into things like the NHS. Like my other point about passports for travel, the UK is already outside of the Schengen zone and so migrant workers must enter the UK with a valid passport before and after June 23rd. That will not change. British borders maintain full control of who comes and goes. Should someone have the skills to apply to work in the NHS, then they will still be permitted travel and given an opportunity to apply for a job. Worst case, points based assessment, like the US, Canada and Australia use, will come into effect. The UK is likely to negotiate freedom of labour movement though, in exchange for freedom of goods movement.

You are not voting to move jobs nor production out of the UK! The EU actually helped fund the move of Ford Transit production from the UK to Turkey... Yes, the EU helped give UK jobs to people in Turkey by giving Ford a loan of £80m with very generous terms!

What you are voting for is UK sovereignty. You are voting to stay in or leave a political union of leaders and representatives that you British people did not elect. You are voting against a commission of unelected, elite men that nobody at all voted for and yet they make decisions on our behalf. You are simply voting to bring sovereignty back to Westminster, and that is all. If you worry about that because you don't like the Conservative government, look at the reality. Their majority in parliament is very slim. They have been blocked on big decisions already. You are therefore not giving sovereignty to David Cameron, but to the UK House of elected representatives. Do not be fooled by the fear campaigns that are simply run by the wealthy, who need EU money to thrive! Think about the future, and your family's future.

Good post Max.

P2737

I suggest the UK resigns from the UN as well.

We haven't voted for the "controllers" of that body either.

-=-===

Max.

Have a look at the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Union and government representation.

Are you asking for referendums for the passage of "bills, regulation, statutes" in the UK? Or should all the international bodies (WTO etc.) have their representatives elected by the public vote before they are allowed to represent the UK?

You could have a referendum every week.

The so called Democracy arguments are mostly fallacious.

Get real.

bet Fred won't highlight any article from today's guardian ......

In a traumatised Netherlands, faith in the EU is plummeting

and

Sterling swings as polls suggest UK heading for EU exit

put the way we would all think of it .....

£ will currently buy € 1.283
a year ago it was about € 1.41

Yes and i remember the exchange rate a few years ago, when it was
down to around the 1.13 euro area...

"WE"?

Do you mean wee, wee, wee?