Today they have fallen 22% to a new low of 223p ..are they another Marconi..?



The chart looks like one long suicide note.

Probably a good punt if you are of that way of thinking but, not for me, I will stick with Lloyds. Other factor may be the deal to be struck in the US as to how the debts are to be valued.

damn charts are down here (again!), but came to the conclusion that there was little downside at this price

hi gus

watched politics prog on bbc2.......they had usa economist who reckons deal will be out by thursday.....it takes 2 days to get it through congress as both parties haggle over things. i dont know if anyone watched programme but the economist was very interesting to listen to with regard banks

Offer the no's a free lunch if they vote yes

i reckon mr.bush will get his texan gun out and point it at a few of them

Or send his Saudi mates round to have a word with them.

If short selling isn't allowed on Financial Stocks why is Paulson still being allowed to short HBOS? I'm confused.

Regulatory Announcement

Company Paulson & Co. Inc.
TIDM
Headline Short Selling Disclosure- HBOS PLC
Released 15:06 30-Sep-08
Number 7196E15

RNS Number : 7196E
Paulson & Co. Inc.
30 September 2008

TR-4 :
Disclosure of Short Position relating to UK Financial Sector Company

1. Full name of person(s) holding the disclosable short position :Paulson & Co. Inc.

2: Name of the issuer of the relevant securities HBOS PLC

3: Disclosable short position 0.95%

4. Date that disclosable short position was held

29 September 2008

i think they are not forced to close but are obligated (not obliged!) to make daily returns to show position

I think you will find that Paulson had been left with a short position somewhat higher when ban was introduced, but managed to buy hbos yesterday, which lowered the position. They also did the same with lloy yesterday.

Thanks for replies. I thought all short positions had to be closed on the day it was announced and that no more shorting whatsoever was allowed. So the HBOS shares can still be manipulated down.
I do hope Lloyds can have nothing to do with this. It could be an advantage for them. Of course I am not suggesting anything of the sort.

another down day if anything Lloyds are looking the best pick of the banks.

As I understand it companies that had open short position were not allowed to open any more short position, but were free to close them at any time. So as these position are lowered they are required to report the lower position, so I guess they just took advantage of yesterdays lower prices to lower there exposure.

I believe this is how it works, but I'm happy to be corrected if wrong.

mitzy .... that all depends on this deal between HBOS and LLOY ..... if it stands up on the original terms, then HBOS are ridiculously cheap relative to LLOY

i see that it has been mooted that the deal will be renegotiated to 0.6 instead of 0.83 LLOY shares per HBOS ...... IF that happens to be true AND there is no white knight appearing, then HBOS is priced at approx 10% discount to the offer - generally about right when the time element is built in .... unless LLOY tumbles anew, that makes HBOS quite an attractive and safe punt (or even investment!)

looks like a smart move yesterday ..... thanks mitzy or whoever who reminded me to look again

Wow HBOS up 37% something happening.

Be back above 2.00 tomorrow with Americans vote going the right way - Even I'm leaving my money in today, with stop losses in place of course ! :-)

I think most rises are built in today ahead of any decision from the USA concerning the $700 billion. I hope for you it rises but I have a nasty feeling it has risen to much today ready for a fall Thursday

Still at a discount to Lloyds share offer so should still have a bit of steam in the old girl yet - can see there being a lot of ups and downs to come also, especially over next few months, when the banks lose their court cases on unfair charges - good job it hasn't happened over last couple of weeks or more would go to the wall. Government need to secure all deposits in all the British banks like they have in Ireland ! Go on Gordon,you know it makes sense !

Personally think Lloyds is paying well over the odds for HBOS and looks like the market does too. As a commentator said yesterday Lloyds has HBOS over a barrel. Companies with cash are Kings and those with dubious exponential debts are not.. The market seems to think that Barclay's got a very good deal cherry picking Lehman's though I would not be happy if I had been a Lehman's bond holder seeing those monstrous bonuses goingh to Lehman's staff, and that Lloyds has got a bad deal with buying HBOS at this rate. Lloyds are supposedly going to need 16 billion to take over this company and it is very risky. They will do well if this is a short recession but if it turns into a depression which looks more likely by the day then they are advised to stay well clear. Lloyds shareholders are not going to be happy about this deal even if it helps save Gordon Brown's bacon