starting this thread, which i hope will be short-lived, to keep the board up to date with latest reports gleaned from the net

Why is the spectre of entering a Muslim country one of the dominant factors. The conflict in Libya has nothing to do with religion. It is merely the population rising up against a violent dictator. If we can accept the rebel government as being more representative of the will of the Libyan people then go into Libya at the defence and the request of the people in the east.

Ricardo

I was / am in favour of military intervention to prevent MG slaughtering his own people and I doubt anyone would deny that outcome should the rebels fail. I imagine the coalition partners were desperately hoping MG would step down in the face of military might, but unfortunately that was always going to be unlikely. Had he done so I suspect there may have been a relatively peaceful transition to some kind of democratic government without the need for AL / UN / NATO oversight. What we're now faced with is the high possibility of mission creep and the potential for a peace keeping force when MG is either defeated or departs of his own accord. Although it is difficult to ascertain the size of his support, he certainly has some and reconciliation between the opposing parties could be difficult.

UNSCR 1973 imposes a no-fly zone and protection of Libyan civilians, but does not go so far as to impose regime change; actually I think regime change is an implied task of the UNSCR, simply because it is inconceivable to believe the civilian population can be protected unless he is removed from power. I guess the politicians hope that if the rebels work up a head of steam they can overcome government forces and as sentiment changes, MG's support will dwindle until his position becomes untenable. What we don't know for sure is how committed his support is / will be.

As to arming the rebels? No. Although they don't have the same heavy equipment the government possess, as they make progress, government troops will swap sides taking this equipment with them. In any event the Coalition are levelling the playing field by flattening the heavy armour.

What does concern me is that this is a similar situation to Iraq, in so much as there was a plan for war, but no plan for peace. Inevitably the speed of action was dictated by the imminent onset of slaughter, but I'm not sure we or anyone else knows what a new Libya will represent. Who are the rebels and will they have the support of the majority. Many unanswered questions and the genie is out of the bottle.

peter - i don't think it is fair to draw a parallel with iraq, for there, we were all suckered into an immediate invasion based on an outright lie (as it happens) ..... however, there is no question that the genie is indeed out of the bottle, and of course no one can predict the future of libya with any certainty at all .... very much fingers crossed that the transition, when indeed it comes, will be comparatively untraumatic and not require anything draconian from the (world) coalition

The parallel is only the lack of a plan for peace rather than the manner in which we were suckered into OP TELIC.

can one have a plan for peace when "we" are currently only peripherally involved and there is perhaps even less certainty than usual?

Any plan for peace assumes a knowledge of who and what the rebels represent. I hope there is at least some understanding of that particular aspect.

Cynic,

Before responding, sometimes it would be beneficial to engage your brain.

I didn't say Libya was a friend of Israel's, but check the Arab league and see who accepted the Israel as a state.

Check the relationship of the previous Egyptian administration,

Check relationship with Saudi Arabia and some of Syria's "actions".

Sarkowsy and Cameron led the charge, although they had not considered doing so, until I think they thought it politically advantageous and out of self aggrandisement.

I thought many of their early statements likely to entrench Gaddafi
and increase the likely bloodshed.

I believe Cameron is sometimes spokesman for Britain, but would be better sticking to his salesman role.

Hays.

In one way religion has little to do with the current "conflict" in Libya, but there are many in the ME, who will argue that any "Western" intervention is the beginning of a new crusade.

Especially, if it suits their purpose. Reality is not considered useful sometimes.

That is part of the problem.

as i have said several times, israel is a total sideshow in this scene

you are welcome to your view of the current uk gov't, even if what you tend to state as fact is rather removed from same ..... potentially politically advantageous? .... quite possibly, but that is what all politics are about .... self-aggrandisement? .... i don't buy that except arguably in general political terms, and if that is the case, then the rest of parliament applauded cameron's stance anyway

At the moment Israel is a side issue.

But I bet Israel is looking on with interest

Edit.

so will south africa

And Capello plus the Jew, Drogba.

Is Drogba a jew, I thought he was black.

so was sammy davis junior! .... there's also coptic jews from ethiopia

Was Sammy a jew I thought he was black

Falashas
Indian Jews
Chinese Jews
And, really bad news for you, hay parrot, even pregnant Jews

i thought SJ was born jewish, but apparently he converted .....and by the way, don't forget that one of the largest jewish populations used to be found in iran (mesopotamia)

What larger than New York

There were about 2 million across Iran and the Arab world, most of whom were forced to flee. Most wanted to stay in the lands of their birth but were forced out.
Unlike the Arabs living in the UN mandated nation of Israel who left because the Arab nations told them to get out of the way before they invaded Israel and wiped it off the face of the earth.

The worldwide Jewish population is 13.3 million Jews. Jewish population growth worldwide is close to zero percent. From 2000 to 2001 it rose 0.3%, compared to worldwide population growth of 1.4%.

In 2001, 8.3 million Jews lived in the Diaspora and 4.9 million lived in Israel. Just about half of the worlds Jews reside in the Americas, with about 46 percent in North America. (top)

Approximately 37% of worldwide Jewry lives in Israel. Israel's Jewish population rose by 1.6% the past year, while the Diaspora population dropped by 0.5%.

Europe, including the Asian territories of the Russian Republic and Turkey, accounts for about 12 percent of the total. Fewer than 2 percent of the worlds Jews live in Africa and Oceania.

Metropolitan Tel Aviv, with 2.5 million Jews, is the world's largest Jewish city. It is followed by New York, with 1.9 million, Haifa 655,000, Los Angeles 621,000, Jerusalem 570,000, and southeast Florida 514,000.

In 2001, 8 countries had a Jewish population of 100,000 or more; another 5 countries had 50,000 or more. There is not a single Diaspora country where Jews amounted to 2.5 percent of the total population. Only 3 Diaspora countries had more than 1 percent. Gibraltar (24.0 per 1000), United States (20.1), Canada (11.9), France (8.8), Uruguay (6.7), Argentina (5.3), Hungary (5.2), and Australia (5.1)[1] had the highest ratios.

Where is Iran pedantic. More bullshit from him.

"Where is Iran pedantic. More bullshit from him. "

Think about it............