Thought Id start this one going because its rather dead on this board at the moment and I suppose all my usual muckers are either at the Stella tennis event watching Dim Tim (lose again) or at Henly Regatta eating cucumber sandwiches (they wish,...NOT).

Anyway please feel free to just talk to yourself blast away and let it go on any company or subject you wish. Just wish Id thought of this one before.

cheers GF.

When interest rates rise and they will do a lot quicker than some think i hate to think just what the housing market is going to look like.

IMO this is the USA 2007 - 2011 but a lot worse.

Wavy Davy and U Turn George are panic striken.

Even the Forces have now turned on them.

Both of them along with the cabinet havent a clue and why should they given their isolated priviledged upbringing.

Lab today 11 points in front in a right wing tory sheet. This is just the beginning.

Tory conference exclusive: Donors are deserting the Conservatives for Ukip


Since 2010, 14 major supporters switch to give £500,000 to Eurosceptics, while Nigel Farage also picks up smaller donations as numbers giving to Tories is halved


Jane Merrick, John Rentoul


Sunday 29 September 2013



A string of Conservative donors has deserted David Cameron and poured nearly half a million pounds into Ukip's election fighting fund, The Independent on Sunday can reveal.


Fourteen individuals have switched support from the Conservatives to Nigel Farage's party in the three years since the 2010 election, donating £488,000 to Ukip. An analysis of Electoral Commission figures also shows that the number of individual donors to the Tories overall has halved since the election, while the average donation has decreased by £14,000.

News of the donor-defectors to Ukip emerged on the eve of the Tory party conference in Manchester, in which the Prime Minister will urge the country not to give up on the coalition's austerity plan, declaring that "we are on the right track" and that the Tory party is there "for hardworking people".



http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/tory-conference-exclusive-donors-are-deserting-the-conservatives-for-ukip-8846599.html

Many say chase the money when something is suspicious.

Who does finance UKIP and come to that, have we seen a complete list of cons "sponsors"?

You could say that for all the parties...where do they get the money?

Cons = companies and rich folk.

No Lab = Unions and the precept.

Dim/Libs = where do they get their money?

Ukip = seem to be attracting disgruntled tories.


You guess is as good as mine.

fred - i don't know how this "help to buy" thingy actually works, but a £200k mortgage - a reasonable guess for a good house in a decent area - will cost about £8.5k pa = £950 pm (don't forget tax allowances) on a 25 year mortgage (I'ld guess) ...... if both partners are working in admittedly quite well but hardly excessively paid jobs, that should be affordable without hardship

Yes, £8-9k in interest on the loan, what about the principal?

Labour is Unions, companies and rich folk. A large amount of their money used to come from large individual donations. That has changed and most donors have left Labour and now they have not much more than the unions. It will be interesting to see if they get any money for the election.

I bet they do.

MK.

The figures (from memory) I used was incomes and not salaries.

But either would do.

The thing relevant is distribution of "income" to age of "group" who may wish to initiate in housing market and accept "unreasonable" risk.

Hyper-valuation, within the market increasing, due to subprime mortgage.

Also, more of a problem is low expected increases in incomes for the lower end of the income groups.

£200 grand for first time house Cyners, cant swing a cat round in them cereal boxes.

you obviously live in a very smart and expensive area ..... in any case, as a first time buyer, you can't expect to live in a some 4-bedroom detached with a nice garden

=============

MK - you're right of course; my brain was being unusually dead even for me, so add £8k pa = approx £650 pm for capital over 25 years, bring the monthly total to about £1,600 on a £200k house

However, don't forget there is surely still mortgage tax relief and also, as the years go by, both capital and interest get repaid.

i'm sure there's someone here who can readily work out the true monthly repayment (have arbitrarily allowed 4% interest over the period)before tax relief

anyway, surely it's better to have some help than none?

electionista ‏@electionista 23h
UK - YouGov/Sunday Times poll: CON 31%, LAB 42%, LDEM 9%, UKIP 13%

Anyone else think theirs a chance of Britain becoming a 2 party nation?.

Heres my senario going up to next election...... Tories do a deal with UKIP and have 44% of vote, labour have 42% so obviously cant beat them even with fringe partys.

Lib dems become fed up and frustrated so join labour which gives them 52% of vote a overal majority of 8%.

As time goes by more and more Liberals fully join labour and both partys integrate, meanwhile Tory back benches cant do with extreme right wing antics of UKIP and their alliance breaks up.

Tories are left as a small fringe party and dead in the water.

COULD EASILY HAPPEN.

Cynic,

There is one thing which is not being taken into consideration and that is a number of first time buyers are graduates who have run up debts because University and "secondary" education "living costs" of £30,000-£40,000 by the time they get into the "work market".

It may be different for the kids of mummies and daddies, who have benefitted, or lived on down handed money. They may not deterred from going onto to secondary education knowing that they maybe bailed out by their parents.

The policies being introduced are splitting those from whose parents have, from those of parents who don't.

This is one of the reasons I dislike the many of the present Con party policies and the braying mob which they are designed for.

Also, I dislike the fact general taxation (Tax payers money) is being directed into subsidising those who have the good fortune to have an "income" high enough to purchase a property, against increasing the number of "state" owned properties for those on lesser incomes and prospects.

The Hairyfax seem to be offering near 5x salary for a single buyer.

ie, an income of £26k gets you an offer of £124800 without the bells and whistles.

An income of £42k will get you the £200k

http://www.halifax.co.uk/mortgages/forms/minicalc/container.asp#result


Doesent seem to be especially prudent.


Then tried the repayment thingy to find out how much per month, but it blew up :-)


Problem loading page


Sorry, the page you’re looking for can’t be found.

Fred did you know that 2/3rds of the houses Maggie sold off on the cheap have now fallen into private landlords hands.?.

>> Fred.

Good point about student debt, forgot that one :-(

By
Kevin Maguire

Ed Miliband should treat David Cameron like the loser he truly is
30 Sep 2013 07:52

One of the lessons of the past six months is the Labour leader should treat the PM with less respect

Dave Cameron's used to playing second fiddle to Boris Johnson but to be shunted to third in the queue behind Nigel Farage is personally humiliating.

Sensitive soul, the Prime Minister. Thin-skinned too, easily riled. And petulant if not treated with the deference he demands - aren't you David? So both Johnson and UKIP upstart Farage beating him in the Tory popularity contest will have the PM turning crimson in Manchester.

One of the lessons of the past six months is Labour's Ed Miliband should treat Cameron with less respect.

The destruction of the welfare state by Cameron and his axeman Iain Duncan Smith, who married into money, is an act of social vandalism that demands the gloves come off.

While both front crawl at weekends, Cameron in the Chequers pool, IDS in the pool at his wife's mini Chequers, disabled people hit by the bedroom tax fear eviction.

Nor is Trust Fund Tory "Sir" George Osborne short of a few bob.

The Tory leader evidently enjoys running the country, displaying the repellent sense of entitlement of a chap who believes he was born to rule.

But Miliband needs to finish what he started last week in Brighton and treat Cameron as a Number 10 tenant facing eviction.

Johnson looks down on Cameron, the old Bullingdon hierarchy when the London Mayor was senior club man continuing into contemporary Tory politics. Farage's contempt for Cameron is why a national Tory-UKIP electoral pact is impossible with Dave in Downing Street. It'll be excruciating for the PM when the "fruitcakes, loonies and closet racists, mostly" stream out of the security zone to cheer Farage the Turbo Tory in Manchester.

I've seen Cameron put on a good face in public but inside he'll be hurting.

To embrace so publicly the Thatcher he'd shunned is a sign of weakness, not strength. The Tory slogan "For hardworking people" is a breach of the trade descriptions act when Cameron sides with six energy rip-off conglomerates against businesses and households.

Behind the studied self-congratulation is the slowest economic recovery in history, Cameron stealing the living standards of families.

Growth of 2.2% in three years when the Office for Budget Responsibility predicted 8.2% is why sidekick Osborne is a downgraded Chancellor.

Carving up the NHS for privatisation will come back to haunt Cameron. Cameron lurching Rightwards, posing in 2013 as the leader the Tory faithful wanted in 2010, won't help in 2015.

By the next election he'll have led the Cons for nigh on a decade. Familiarity breeds contempt and Miliband will be secretly cheered by Farage and, who knows, maybe Johnson, when he shows Cameron no mercy.

It's the best way of saving the welfare state and all that's good about Britain.



Check out all the latest News, Sport & Celeb gossip at Mirror.co.uk http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/ed-miliband-should-treat-david-2322703#ixzz2gMTjuhp1

I haven't got a clue about how the parties will line up at the next election, but I can see if UkiP, BNP and cons align themselves together, many Lib/Dems voters will vote Labour, in an attempt to prevent the "far right combination" getting into power.

The present tory rhetoric may divorce the "more moderate followers" from their rank ranks.

============

I wonder how many times maggie's name and stormy norman's names will be taken in vain by our gallant leaders this week at Manchester.

fred - you are rather (intentionally i suspect) muddling up several issues in one ..... i could certainly argue that many children should not go to university for worthless degrees in the first place and/or ask how many of them take term/holiday work to keep themselves at least half-way solvent .... but that is a totally different issue.

try staying with the question, which is really whether or not there should be help for first time buyers.
while there may be some question as to the detail of the plan proposed - i happen to think a £600k level is preposterous and should be set considerably lower - i think the concept can be nothing but good, but then of course i believe in private ownership ..... you may think everyone should live in a commune

btw, it is also exceedingly patronising (not sure that that is the right word) of you to think that it is only wealthy parents who help there offspring ...... that is total baloney, though heaven forfend that i should accuse you of bending the facts to suit your stance

Fred said.......
Fred1new - 30 Sep 2013 09:14 - 30168 of 30169
I haven't got a clue about how the parties will line up at the next election, but I can see if UkiP, BNP and cons align themselves together, many Lib/Dems voters will vote Labour, in an attempt to prevent the "far right combination" getting into power.

The present tory rhetoric may divorce the "more moderate followers" from their rank ranks...........................ends

more or les how I see it aswel hence my prediction of a 2 party country.