Thought Id start this one going because its rather dead on this board at the moment and I suppose all my usual muckers are either at the Stella tennis event watching Dim Tim (lose again) or at Henly Regatta eating cucumber sandwiches (they wish,...NOT).

Anyway please feel free to just talk to yourself blast away and let it go on any company or subject you wish. Just wish Id thought of this one before.

cheers GF.

Cyners ........Idleitus.................

Soaring UK personal debt wreaking havoc with mental health, report warns
Centre for Social Justice says poorer people 'bearing brunt of storm' as debt hits £1.4tn – almost as high as economic output

The Guardian, Wednesday 20 November 2013

Credit card debt has trebled to £55.6bn since 1998 while overall personal debt including mortgages has reached £1.4tn. Photograph: Alan Schein Photography
Personal debt in Britain has reached £1.4tn – almost the same amount as Britain's national economic output – according to a report that warns debt is wreaking havoc on people's mental health and wellbeing.

Poorer people are "bearing the brunt of a storm" during which average household debt has risen to £54,000 – nearly double what it was a decade ago, the report by the Centre for Social Justice thinktank warns.

The report, entitled Maxed Out, found that almost half of households in the lowest income decile spent more than a quarter of their income on debt repayments in 2011. More than 5,000 people are being made homeless every year as a result of mortgage or rent debts.

Christian Guy, director of the thinktank established in opposition by the work and pensions secretary, Iain Duncan Smith, said: "Problem debt can have a corrosive impact on people and families. Our report shows how it can wreak havoc on mental health, relationships and wellbeing. Across the UK people are up until the early hours worrying about their finances and bills."



The report, written by the former Labour work and pensions minister Chris Pond, found that:

• Personal debt in the UK, including mortgage lending, stands at £1.4tn – an average of £54,000 per household compared with £29,000 a decade ago.

• Consumer debt had trebled since 1993 and now stands at £158bn;

• More than 8m households have no savings, including half of low-income households;

• Outstanding debt on credit cards has almost trebled since 1998 to reach £55.6bn;

• There were 300,000 arrears on mortgage in 2012 – with 34,000 homes repossessed. This is a reduction of 30% from the peak of the recession but a 60% overall increase since 2006.

Pond said: "With falling real incomes and increasing costs of basic essentials, many – especially the most vulnerable – are sliding further into problem debt. The costs to those affected, in stress and mental disorders, relationship breakdown and hardship is immense. But so too is the cost to the nation, measured in lost employment and productivity and in an increased burden on public services."

The report found that the decision of mainstream banks to refuse credit to the less well off has led to a dramatic increase in the demand for short-term credit – from payday lenders, pawnbrokers and doorstop lenders – which is now worth £4.8bn a year. More than 1.4 million people have no access to a bank account and "are effectively excluded from the entire financial sector". This contributes to the "poverty premium", a £1,280 annual surcharge on everyday goods and services faced by low-income households.

Payday lenders have increased their business from £900m in 2008-09 to more than £2bn – accounting for around 8m loans – in 2011-12. The number of people resorting to loan sharks has increased to 310,000 people.

The report says: "For the most financially excluded, there is often no option but to turn to illegal moneylenders. It is estimated that over 310,000 people borrow money from these criminals each year. Illegal moneylenders extort money from their victims, often arbitrarily raising interest rates, demanding payments or charging penalties. Their use of violence and intimidation terrorises people and communities, enforcing a 'veil of silence' that allows them to escape detection. This is an inexcusable crime in modern Britain.

Many of the side effects of problem debt can also work to drive people further into debt, creating a vicious cycle. While it is often hard to prove causation, there is a clear relationship between the following and problem debt: unemployment, family breakdown, addiction, and poor mental health. Similarly, many of these factors are interrelated, meaning problem debt can have diverse causes, requiring multidimensional support in order to fully resolve the underlying problems."

Cyners....now having read above you know your talking tripe about increased living standards.

The report, written by the former Labour work and pensions minister Chris Pond ..... There were 300,000 arrears on mortgage in 2012 – with 34,000 homes repossessed. This is a reduction of 30% from the peak of the recession but a 60% overall increase since 2006.

That was the bit i was looking for ..... frankly, referring back to 2006 really isn't very useful at all ..... personally, i'ld rather rely on the source i quoted from, which was shown on a bbc web site

CML had no reason to lie or distort their figures, and their numbers certainly look an awful lot chirpier than those you indicated, especially as CP has/had an axe to grind

Ohhhhh give up. Living standards arent rising in fact they are getting worse due to debt.

All that is happening instead of adding to long term debt at the Bank people are seeking out short term debt with money lenders etc etc. and then landing themselves in even more hotter water. Its a transfer over thats happening because Banks wont lend.

Your out of touch you Cyners and so is your budy Hays, totaly out of touch.

In a recession living standards fall. Then the economy improves and lastly living standards improve.

UK factory orders hit highest level in 18 years

British factory orders jumped unexpectedly in October to their strongest level since March 1995





By Telegraph Staff

11:43AM GMT 21 Nov 2013

Comments3 Comments





British factory orders have jumped unexpectedly this month to their strongest level since March 1995, according to the Confederation of British Industry's monthly industrial trends survey.


The CBI survey's total order book balance rose to +11 this month to from -4 in October, well above expectations of a reading of 0 and the long-run average of -17.


The balance for total output over the previous three months surged to +29 from +8, the highest level since January 1995 and again well above the long-run average of +2. The index of output expectations rose to +24 from +9.


Growth was widely spread, with electrical engineering being the only sector to see a decline, the CBI said.


"This new evidence shows encouraging signs of a broadening and deepening recovery," said Stephen Gifford, the CBI's director of economics.



more: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/economics/10465017/UK-factory-orders-hit-highest-level-in-18-years.html

Living standards arent improving. Actually the opposite.

Thats why the growth in pay day lenders and charitys is at its biggest ever. Add food banks to that aswel.

Public service workers are getting nil pay rises, private sector very similar or even cutting wages, benefits restricted to 1% rise per annum.

I think you and Cyners are on a different planet.

Living standards are the last to improve. I wouldn't expect it to happen before the middle of next year. If living standards were getting better now, I would be concerned about the economy and the handling of it.

Hays your mate doesnt agree with you.

Interesting to see the co-op bank in trouble. That paragon of virtue in ethical banking has been brought so low by a corrupt and criminal Labour activist who has apparently stolen money from a charity, bought hard drugs etc etc. The bank has a black hole of £1.5bn

Nice to have one's prejudices and suspicions confirmed.

This clearly leads back to Miliband's door.

ha ha ha he he he. Oh dear.

Clutching at straws.

Hays the public dont give a toss, but it would appear Osbourne is now being pulled in to the debate. That should be interesting and Camorons smear tactics back firing on him.

By the way just out..........

electionista‏@electionista
UK - YouGov/Sun poll: CON 32%, LAB 40%, LDEM 9%, UKIP 12%

So Ed Balls got a £50k donation from the co-op group plus huge donations to Labour Party.

Despite the economic crisis – and the Co-op’s dire finances – the group has increased its political donations from £664,000 in 2008 to £880,000 last year.

Flowers boasted to MPs earlier this month that he had helped oversee an increase in the maximum annual donations to £1.15million before stepping down.

Following the Number 10 dinner, Mr Miliband appointed Flowers to his exclusive business advisory board.

The Labour leader went on to hold dinners with Flowers and other business figures at Westminster restaurants in July and November of 2011.

This March, he invited Flowers for private talks at his Commons office. The following month the Co-op Bank threw Labour a financial lifeline with a £1.2million loan

Osbourne now being asked why after the present govt have been on coop watch for 3 years including the lloyds aborted deal didnt know anything about the problems.

Boots on tuther foot now hays.

See the national news.

Osbourne being pointed out as the villain.

Some European meeting coming into it.

Certainly looks like fat Dave and Lynton Crosbys smear has back fired.

sticky - clearly you can't read or didn't bother even though my posts are succinct

i don't write politician-speak, so at no point have i even insinuated in any way that living standards were improving ..... do i really have to c+p the salient points i posted?

"Revolution of modern clubs, titanium faced drivers and shafts make golf unrecognisable from those days."... Your right there CC, I've never heard of most of that, If I did get the clubs out again they will be my Ram Acubars.

all sorts of things, including general fitness of the pros, but the technology of the ball is also a significant factor

My first set of clubs Stan I bought second hand in 1987 were Neil Coles (must have been 20 years old then) stainless steel shafts, blades. God knows how i learned to play with them. Still got and use the sand iron.

and neil coles is still playing a bit .... i saw him a couple of months back at some company golf day at west hill (next door to worplesdon)