Thought Id start this one going because its rather dead on this board at the moment and I suppose all my usual muckers are either at the Stella tennis event watching Dim Tim (lose again) or at Henly Regatta eating cucumber sandwiches (they wish,...NOT).

Anyway please feel free to just talk to yourself blast away and let it go on any company or subject you wish. Just wish Id thought of this one before.

cheers GF.

Hays,


For a moment I thought you were growing up.

Mandela is not responsible for others behaving corruptly, they are responsible for their own actions.

But I doubt that the the Members of the ANC etc. are any more corrupt than many members of the present UK government, the only thing is that the latter is more sophisticated in their actions.

What I mean is that there is no real legacy of Mandela. SA is drifting towards the other corrupt African countries. Politicians like Zuma pay lip service to Mandela because it is popular.

It's snouts in the trough, different time, different snouts, same result.

Living standards to be lower in 2015 than in 2010, IFS warns

Delivering its judgment on George Osborne's autumn statement, Institute for Fiscal Studies backs claims by Ed Balls that family budgets are being squeezed hard


Larry Elliott and Phillip Inman


The Guardian, Friday 6 December 2013 16.11 GMT



http://www.theguardian.com/business/2013/dec/06/ifs-living-standards-lower-osborne-autumn-statement

But not for MP's of course.

Stop complaining about immigrants and find a job of your own, former M&S boss says

High street veteran Sir Stuart Rose claims it's not the fault of Bulgarians and Romanians if they are prepared to come to the UK and work longer hours, and for less money, than Britons are prepared to






By Steve Hawkes, Consumer Affairs Editor

12:03PM GMT 08 Dec 2013







High street veteran Sir Stuart Rose has told people complaining about immigrants coming to work in Britain to go out and find a job of their own.


The former Marks & Spencer chief executive said it was not the fault of Bulgarians or Romanians or any other nationality if they were prepared to work hard for less money than Britons would like.


He told Sky News: "I'm a free market economist, we operate in a free market. If these people want to come here, and work the hours they are prepared to work for the wages they are prepared to work for, then so be it.


"It's up to people to decide what they want to do. I think there are a lot of people who complain about their lot. Life is tough for everybody at times.


"I know people will look at me and 'It's alright for you' but I started off with pretty well nothing, I did a lot of menial jobs when I was young.



More: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/10503821/Stuart-Rose-Bulgarians-taking-our-jobs-immigrants-low-pay-wages-Romanians-EU-benefits.html

a charmed life


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sir_Stuart_Rose

i'm afraid that blatant corruption is endemic (a way of life) throughout africa, kenya being among the worst offenders and i'ld guess south africa somewhere in the middle

but then, what is the difference between corruption and a bit of bakhsheesh or commission to help oil the wheels?

Welcome to the sunlit uplands of blightystan.




UK's first 'social supermarket' opens to help fight food poverty

Community Shop in Goldthorpe gives local shoppers access to surplus food from supermarkets for up to 70% less


Rebecca Smithers


The Guardian, Monday 9 December 2013




Britain's first "social supermarket" opens its doors on Monday, offering shoppers on the verge of food poverty the chance to buy food and drink for up to 70% less than normal high-street prices.

If successful, the Community Shop, in Goldthorpe, near Barnsley, south Yorkshire, which is backed by large retailers and supermarkets, could be replicated elsewhere in Britain.

Community Shop is a subsidiary of Company Shop, Britain's largest commercial re-distributor of surplus food and goods, which works with retailers and manufacturers to tackle their surpluses sustainably and securely.

It sells on residual products, such as those with damaged packaging or incorrect labelling, to membership-only staff shops in factories. The new project goes one step further, located in the community for the first time and also matching surplus food with social need.

Membership of the pilot store – in Goldthorpe, an area of social deprivation – will be restricted to people living in a specific local postcode area who also get welfare support.

Individuals who shop at Community Shop will not only get access to cheaper food, but will also be offered programmes of wider social and financial support, such as debt advice, cookery skills and home budgeting.

The scheme is being supported by retailers, brands and manufacturers, including Asda, Morrisons, Co-operative Food, M&S, Tesco, Mondelez, Ocado, Tetley, Young's and Müller. All are diverting surpluses to the pilot.

Company Shop hopes to open Community Shops in London and beyond next year should the pilot prove successful and sustainable.


More: http://www.theguardian.com/society/2013/dec/09/goldthorpe-social-supermarket-community-shop-food-poverty

Hays,

For me Mandela's legacy was the lack of bloodshed when Apartheid collapse.

This was due to F. W. De Klerk "permitting it" and Mandela grabbing the ball and running with it.

His speeches reduced the expected explosion of violence.

Also, the lowering of "tension" was due to Desmond Tutu.

Many had expected whole scale bloodshed after Apartheid failed. I had friends in South Africa and thought that would occur.

I don't think I would like to live in S.A even now.

------------------###

“Forgiving is not forgetting; its actually remembering--remembering and not using your right to hit back. Its a second chance for a new beginning. And the remembering part is particularly important. Especially if you dont want to repeat what happened.”
― Desmond Tutu


“When we see others as the enemy, we risk becoming what we hate. When we oppress others, we end up oppressing ourselves. All of our humanity is dependent upon recognizing the humanity in others.”
― Desmond Tutu

hays Hays hays.........

labour opening a big lead now on majority of polls.

People saying Tories are arrogant. All that childish sniggering on the front bench on the autumn statement.

electionista ‏@electionista 21m
UK - Populus poll: CON 33%, LAB 41%, LDEM 11%, UKIP 7%

I agree with your comments about South Africa, Fred. It is a stunningly beautiful country, but the poverty some of the population live in is appalling.

while that is true, you may then ask yourself why there is such huge (and prob illegal) immigration, which in itself is causing the SA economy huge problems - e.g. the tax-paying population is minuscule

the answer is actually very simple
though to our eyes, the conditions in the slums are grim (ditto india), those who flood into SA consider the conditions (far) better than whence they came

O/Topic...... Doodlebug, dont let that poster ontheturn bully you. Give him a kick in the gonads.

Ive switched you back on temporarily and I can see that the chap is rather ignorant. Im with you on trafalgar well not the stock but your conduct. Dont stand for it.

Fred
What happened in the past cannot be a legacy.bThe reality is that SA is becoming like the rest of Africa.

You're not allowed to say that.

Or indeed here in some ways H/S, I.E. a race to the bottom "for some".

Hazyone,

It is part of Africa.

It is a little like saying the UK is becoming like Europe.

It is and the culture of UK is similar to the EU.

========

But I would admit SA has huge problems and the road to a true representative government and legal system.

Also, huge problems to introduce the necessary infrastructures for a civilised society.

They have had 19 years so far and probably need another 30-40 years of improvement to reduce "corruption" to a low level.

The UK and Europe, after "how long ?", still has its corrupt and misguided leaders.

Again I would not like to live through their coming turmoil.


“When we see others as the enemy, we risk becoming what we hate. When we oppress others, we end up oppressing ourselves. All of our humanity is dependent upon recognizing the humanity in others.”
― Desmond Tutu