Will this increase or decrease the likelihood of terrorist actions in America, Europe and the rest of the world?

If you were a member of a family murdered in this conflict, would you be seeking revenge?

Should Tzipi Livni and Ehud Olmert, be tried for war crimes if or when this conflict comes to an end?

What will the price of oil be in 4 weeks time?

Added to the above, hyper inflation with its wheelbarrows of cash only happened from 1919 to 1923. Fascism started really during World War I and was based partly on the writings of Karl Marx and a few other left wing intellectuals. There was some right wing politics added much later and finally A Doctrine of Fascism (1932) was written by Benito Mussolini or rather it was ghost written for him. The concept was state control. The nearest we have reached it in recent times is whenever the Labour Party are in power - tax and spend and the rising nanny state.

Hays,

Wait a few years and judge the current British government.

FRED - i can't be bothered to read all the earlier ramblings, but are you saying that this or any government is responsible a rise in nationalism or somesuch? ...... if so, total balderdash ..... such movements can only flourish if there is a significant minority (or even majority) who decide to follow or accept its principles

"Fascism started really during World War I and was based partly on the writings of Karl Marx and a few other left wing intellectuals. "

.....and no doubt was the father of the Molotov-von Ribbentrop love fest.

Great to have the clown with hay in his hat and the fried brain idiot both posting.

This thread gets more and more hilarious LOL

i've now forgotten a lot my german history, but there was strong nationalist movement in germany (still really just a kleinstaatrei at the time) in the early/mid 19th century

Cynic,

Not certain what you are suggesting.

I use to think that governments lead and the mob follow.
Now, sometimes, I think the government look at the mob and pick the current fashionable thought, or thoughts and claim it/them for their own. Slightly modifying these thoughts and regurgitating them back at the mob, through their various PR, or propaganda machines. Hoping, to manipulate the mass, in order to stay in power. Populism!

Applies, to tories, Labour and now more and more to the Lib/Dems..

Again, I doubt many leaders of the present governing cabal believe many of their own slogans.

Another thing, is that rather than give any real authority to the mass, (or perhaps the middle classes) the elite in the present period is trying to maintain power, by denuding itself of as much responsibility as possible and putting itself in position to blame others for its own failings.

(Local level administration given responsibility without adequate funding or powers. (Devolving of responsibilities, etc. which are not wanted by a smaller elitist government.)

Looking over the last 20-30 years, I feel there has been a deterioration of political morality in Britain and more and more importance is based on glib remarks, and catch phrases. I am sceptical of earlier periods and certainly dont think they were pure, but watching at the moment, you can see the intense concentration which is place on presentation and various forms of PR.

The government is concentrating more on packaging, rather than content and this is why you are seeing them frequently back tracking on their chosen policies.

Governments can manipulate the public and do so. In times of economic stress and fragmentation of the public it becomes easier.

There were many reasons for Hitlers rise to power, but the rise was partly because his propaganda and promises were popular with the middle classes and mainly due to the economic problems in Germany at that time.

His propaganda machine utilised the period to gather enough power to put him in place allowing his corruption to flower.

The C+P cut from Wikipedia below shows many similarities to the late 1920 and later periods.

Camerons claims for the need for Strong Government, demonization of Those on Wealth-fare, the unemployed, foreigners. (It is not the Jews this time.)

Try switching Left for right in the paste. The actions remain similar and they aim at same power at the expense or others.

An attempt of government to develop a blind eye, by not being responsible.


Fascism (pronounced /ˈfɪzəm/) is a radical and authoritarian nationalist political ideology.[1][2][3][4] Fascists seek to organize a nation according to corporatist perspectives, values, and systems, including the political system and the economy.[5][6] Fascism was originally founded by Italian national syndicalists in World War I who combined left-wing and right-wing political views, but it gravitated to the political right in the early 1920s.[7][8] Scholars generally consider fascism to be on the far right of the conventional left-right political spectrum.[9][10][11][12][13][14]

Fascists believe that a nation is an organic community that requires strong leadership, singular collective identity, and the will and ability to commit violence and wage war in order to keep the nation strong.[15] They claim that culture is created by the collective national society and its state, that cultural ideas are what give individuals identity, and thus they reject individualism.[15] Viewing the nation as an integrated collective community, they see pluralism as a dysfunctional aspect of society, and justify a totalitarian state as a means to represent the nation in its entirety.[16][17]
They advocate the creation of a single-party state.[18] Fascists reject and resist the autonomy of cultural or ethnic groups who are not considered part of the fascists' nation and who refuse to assimilate or are unable to be assimilated.[19] They consider attempts to create such autonomy as an affront and a threat to the nation.[19] Fascist governments forbid and suppress opposition to the fascist state and the fascist movement.[20] They identify violence and war as actions that create national regeneration, spirit and vitality.[21]

Fascism rejects the concepts of egalitarianism, materialism, and rationalism in favor of action, discipline, hierarchy, spirit, and will.[22] They oppose liberalism (as a bourgeois movement) and Marxism (as a proletarian movement) for being exclusive economic class-based movements.[23] Fascists present their ideology as that of an economically trans-class movement that promotes ending economic class conflict to secure national solidarity.[24] They believe that economic classes are not capable of properly governing a nation, and that a merit-based elite of experienced military persons must rule through regimenting a nation's forces of production and securing the nation's independence.[25] Fascism perceives conservatism as partly valuable for its support of order in society but disagrees with its typical opposition to change and modernization.[26] Fascism presents itself as a solution to the perceived benefits and disadvantages of conservatism by advocating state-controlled modernization that promotes orderly change while resisting the dangers to order in society of pluralism and independent initiative.[26]

Fascists tend to support a "third position" in economic policy, which they believe superior to both the rampant individualism of laissez-faire capitalism and the severe control of state socialism.[27][28] Italian Fascism and most other fascist movements promote a corporatist economy whereby, in theory, representatives of capital and labour interest groups work together within sectoral corporations to create both harmonious labour relations and maximization of production that would serve the national interest.[29] However other fascist movements and ideologies, such as Nazism, did not utilize this form of economy.[29]
========================================================


I hope I am wrong!

ITLOTB
Try reading about fasciism. Here are a few links and references.

http://www.arcaini.com/ITALY/ItalyHistory/RiseOfFascism.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascism

"Fascism was originally founded by Italian national syndicalists in World War I who combined left-wing and right-wing political views, but it gravitated to the political right in the early 1920s."

Italian Fascism and most other fascist movements promote a corporatist economy whereby, in theory, representatives of capital and labour interest groups work together within sectoral corporations to create both harmonious labour relations and maximization of production that would serve the national interest.

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qn4188/is_20080214/ai_n21416731/

a bit like the Labour party and socialists

The fascists were completely against individualism in general and especially against individualism in a free market economy. Their agenda included minimum wage laws, government restrictions on profit- making, progressive taxation of capital, and "rigidly secular" schools.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Doctrine_of_Fascism

sounds like the Labour government

The Fascist conception of the State is all-embracing; outside of it no human or spiritual values can exist, much less have value. Thus understood, Fascism is totalitarian, and the Fascist Statea synthesis and a unit inclusive of all valuesinterprets, develops, and potentiates the whole life of a people.

That is the theory, but the result is a totalitarian state saying it protects the individual, but actually protecting the "elite". Which in many ways is how the some of the present administration see themselves.

In practice Fascism and Communism copy the practices of one another due to similar underlying motivation.

FRED - your posts are far too verbose, but i read the first sentence ..... you forget that gov'ts are as tolerated by the populace, and that even applies to totalitarian regimes, though in the latter, there has to be an overwhelming groundswell for a change to have any chance of being effected ..... it follows that (for example) hitler's rise to power could only occur because the german people's economic situation became intolerable - a bit of a simplification i grant you, but sufficient for the purpose

Yes Fred anything you say Fred Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Cynic,

I am sorry you have such a short mental time span. I would think a little too late for you to improve it.

But without wishing to clarify even further, I relate you back to what I wrote.


"There were many reasons for Hitlers rise to power, but the rise was partly because his propaganda and promises were popular with the middle classes and mainly due to the economic problems in Germany at that time.

His propaganda machine utilised the period to gather enough power to put him in place allowing his corruption to flower."


AlD,

Never thought of you as the most alert of individuals. Signs of deterioration are getting more apparent every day.

fred - i am perfectly capable of reading things that i think worth the effort ..... i am afraid most of your stuff does not qualify

I thought you promised not to read any of what I write!

Getting forgetful as well!

one sentence doesn't count .... unless it's a life sentence

8-)







You must be a member of the Simpson Family.

Fred must be a member of the Simpleton Family

HO, HO!

The London based Palestinian Return Centre is to hold on Friday a workshop during which Professor Salman Abu Sitta will be launching "The Atlas of Palestine 1917-1966" in which he uses documents to "prove rights and to correct wrongs."

Professor Abu Sitta will redraw the contours of Israeli landscape by documenting the erasure of Palestinian history and the ongoing Nakba.

He will map the history of Palestinian Exile. The presentation will provide a historical and forensic analysis of the mechanism of expulsion, which began in 1947 and continues even today. It will also provide graphic illustrations of the policy of expulsion which he has documented in his new atlas. The atlas contains names and descriptions of Palestinian villages that have been destroyed. It also provides names, description and location of Palestinian villages which Israel does not recognize, some of which have recently been under attack to force their residents to move elsewhere.

Many Thousands of Palestinians still carry deeds to their lands and properties. The towns and villages from which they were expelled have been erased from Israeli Maps. Israeli maps also fail to document existing villages that have existed long before any Israeli settlements. Unrecognised villages are denied any basic services from the government.

Professor Abu Sitta is founder and President of Palestine Land Society (London), author of : "The Atlas of Palestine 1948", 2005, "The Return Journey", 2007 and "From Refugees to Citizens at Home", 2001 and "The Atlas of Palestine 1917-1966", 2010 and General Coordinator of the Right of Return Congress.

Chairman of PRC Majed al-Zeer stressed that the launching of this Atlas is important in terms of time and place as Britain bears special historical responsibility for creating the Palestinian problem and the resulting suffering of the Palestinian people during a period which is covered by this distinctive academic work.

As to the timing; al-Zeer said that this work comes to reinforce the Palestinian inalienable rights at a time when there are frantic attempts to liquidate the Palestinian issue through an unjust "peace process".

"Fred must be a member of the Simpleton Family "

Oh don't leave haycrapper out !

The anti Nazi League merged into Unite Against Fascism. This is a bit odd as the Anti Nazi League was set up by the socialist workers Party. If there is anything more Fascist than fascists then it must be socialists. That is apart from Israel which behaves worse than the Nazis.