Thought Id start this one going because its rather dead on this board at the moment and I suppose all my usual muckers are either at the Stella tennis event watching Dim Tim (lose again) or at Henly Regatta eating cucumber sandwiches (they wish,...NOT).

Anyway please feel free to just talk to yourself blast away and let it go on any company or subject you wish. Just wish Id thought of this one before.

cheers GF.

Good to see you supporting others Chris.

Thats the way we should all be, helping each other to make a bob or two.

Perhaphs as the thread author I should try and support this a lot more.

Ill try and have a go.

I speak to Evil K every tuesday evening, Ill try and get his ideas on here.

The Tory Euro threat exposed
16
Friday
May 2014
Posted by Mike Sivier in Benefits, Conservative Party, European Union, Human rights, Immigration, Justice, Politics



Here at Vox Political it has come to our notice that some of you are still thinking of voting ‘Conservative’ in the European Parliament elections. This would be a mistake.

The Conservative Party is trying to hoodwink you into thinking it has a host of great ideas dependent on having a large number of MEPs after May 22, but its own manifesto tells a different story.

Here are just three examples:

1. The lynchpin of the Conservative campaign is the pledge to hold an in/out referendum on Britain’s membership of the European Union. The party’s European manifesto states, “The British people now have a very clear choice: if you want a referendum on whether Britain should stay in the EU or leave, only the Conservative Party can and will hold one.”

This has nothing to do with your vote on May 22. It is a General Election promise involving the UK Parliament, not the Parliament of Europe. It is Westminster MPs who would push through the Tory plans for a referendum during the next UK Parliament, not MEPs in Brussels.

The suggestion that the proposed referendum – which is heavily promoted in the manifesto – has anything to do with these elections is a flat-out lie.

Long-term readers should not be surprised that Conservatives are lying again, but this may come as a surprise to Tory adherents. To them, we should say: “Wake up!”

2. One of the “key changes we will fight for”, listed on page seven of the manifesto, is “National parliaments able to work together to block unwanted European legislation”. If this seems like a good idea to you, it may come as a surprise to learn that it is a key feature of the Lisbon Treaty, that was signed by the last Labour government in 2007. That’s seven years ago!

It’s called the Ioannina Compromise, and it means that, if Member States who are against a decision are significant in number but still insufficient to block it (1/3 of the Member States or 25 per cent of the population), all of the Member States must commit to seeking a solution.

It seems likely that the reason the Conservatives are even mentioning it is that this part of the Lisbon Treaty is only due to come into force this year – 2014.

Tories have ‘form’ in this kind of legerdemain, having recently convinced the British public that they had imposed new rules on benefits claimed by immigrants, when these were in fact already enshrined in UK law.

3. One change the Conservatives are determined to impose is the removal of your ability to defend your human rights.

The manifesto states that they will “Undertake radical reform of human rights laws and publish a detailed plan for reform that a Conservative government would implement immediately: we will scrap Labour’s Human Rights Act, curtail the role of the European Court of Human Rights in the UK and make certain that the UK’s Supreme Court is in Britain and not in Strasbourg.”

Conservatives hate human rights laws because they forbid slavery, servitude and forced labour - such as the Tory-led government’s ‘mandatory work activity’ schemes; they provide a right to a fair trial – currently being removed in the UK by the Tories’ restrictions on Legal Aid; and most importantly they oblige nation states to “prevent foreseeable loss of life” such as that caused by the assessment regime for disability benefits, imposed by the current UK government.

You can read about these, and more, in a previous Vox Political article here.

The European Court of Human Rights is – as everyone should be aware – nothing to do with the European Union at all. It is part of the Council of Europe, which is composed of 47 European nations. The Conservative Party does not need a majority of MEPs to withdraw from it.

However, such a withdrawal would represent a betrayal of the Conservative Party’s great Prime Minister Winston Churchill, the man who is considered most directly responsible for the creation of the Council of Europe and the court. Dedicated Conservatives should consider this point well. None of the people currently running the Conservative Party have anything approaching the stature of a Churchill, yet they are taking it upon themselves to cut Britain off from his legacy – and they are lying to the public about how they need to do it.

In fact, let’s face it, the Tory European Manifesto for 2014 is a pack of lies.

The Conservatives currently have more MEPs than any other UK party, but any unbiased examination of their claims will lead to the conclusion that they deserve to have none at all.

i don't know what raver wrote the above, but what a load of rabble-rousing claptrap
why on earth sticky is giving it oxygen is beyond me

gf
That Sivier guy posts crap on a daily basis. I often read his blog for a good laugh.

Ukip has divided the left, not the right, and cut Labour off from its 'old' support

Labour and Ukip voters agree on more economic issues than you might think, presenting a strategic problem for Ed Miliband


Robert Ford and Matthew Goodwin


theguardian.com, Friday 16 May 2014 11.00 BST

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/may/16/ukip-divided-left-right-cut-labour-support



Ukip leader Nigel Farage … ‘Old left voters retain a strong distrust of Labour’s middle-class elites after decades of feeling ignored as New Labour chased the middle-class swing vote.' Photograph: John Stillwell/PA




According to conventional wisdom, Ukip has "divided the right". By targeting Europe, immigration and politicians in Westminster, Nigel Farage is tearing off a section of the Conservative base that David Cameron desperately needs if he is to triumph in 2015.

But while it is true that Ukip is currently winning over most of its support from people who voted Conservative in 2010, this actually tells us less than commentators often claim.

In 2010 Labour was at a low ebb, Gordon Brown was extremely unpopular and traditional Labour voters were angry about immigration and the financial crisis. Defining "the right" as 2010 Conservative voters is therefore risky. A lot of those who voted Conservative in 2010 may not have been natural Conservatives at all, backing Cameron despite their misgivings about his party, as a vote against a failed and unpopular Labour government.

A more sensible way of defining left and right is in ideological terms. Ever since Clement Attlee's 1945 Labour victory, British politics has been structured around a conflict over the economy and the proper role of the state.

The left has favoured higher taxation, redistribution and greater state intervention. The right has favoured free markets, low taxes and a small state. This is still a central dividing line today.

Ed Miliband's most celebrated policy announcement called for state regulation of gas and electricity prices, and he has shown a distrust of big business, and a desire for greater taxation of the rich, and greater government help for the less well-off. The Conservatives, meanwhile, retain their traditional faith in free markets and private enterprise.

If Ukip is just dividing the right then we would expect to see Ukip voters falling consistently on the Conservative side of this longstanding divide. But as our chart below shows (based on new data from the British Election Study), the opposite is in fact true.





An average of 71% of Ukip voters agree with five leftwing ideological statements, far above the Conservatives (43%) or even the Liberal Democrats (65%). They are only a little behind Labour (81%).

When Ed Miliband argues that big business takes advantage of ordinary people, employees on zero-hour contracts are being exploited by management, that the rich exempt themselves from the rules that apply to others, and that ordinary workers are not benefitting from a recovery for the rich, Ukip voters agree with him. On these core economic issues, Farage and Ukip do not divide the right. They divide the left.




This raises an obvious but also awkward question for progressives. If Ukip's struggling, pessimistic and left-behind voters find these economic messages appealing, why are they supporting Farage, not Miliband?

The problem for Labour is that these voters no longer think about politics in general, or Labour in particular, in economic terms. Labour has encouraged this: New Labour played down traditional leftwing ideology in favour of social liberalism and pragmatic centrism. Now many voters with longstanding "old left" economic values associate Labour more with "new left" social liberalism: feminism, multiculturalism and support for immigration.

Ukip's rise has exposed this division on the left and made it harder to heal. Many of the "new left" voters attracted to Labour by its social liberalism cannot stomach Ukip voters' strong opposition to immigration, which they regard as an expression of ignorance and prejudice, and so refuse to engage with "old left" voters on the economic issues where the two groups share common ground.

Conversely, "old left" voters retain a strong distrust of Labour's middle-class elites, after decades of feeling ignored and marginalised as New Labour chased the middle-class swing vote, and cannot abide lectures from privileged "new left" activists about the virtues of immigration and diversity.

Tony Blair's winning recipe in 1997 was to bury the traditional "old left" Labour ideology, gambling that he could expand Labour's coalition without losing traditional support, as the voters who endorsed it had nowhere else to go. Nigel Farage's rise has made this Blairite balancing act impossible. Ukip has divided the left, splitting the old from the new, and cutting Labour off from struggling voters it seeks to champion.

Natal vs Murray starting on Sky Sports 3

Another one for you to duck Haystack.

I thought you would have liked it, being as it's from the people's daily :-)

Do you mean the 'silly peoples' daily

Or

The silly 'people's daily'?

That was the Guardian Haystack, the veritable holy book of the left.


And it's speaking heresy.... :-)

I need to pick someones brains.If on transactions on buys and sells a sell of 350,000,000 is closely followed by another sell of 350,000,000 but with a minus against it what does this mean.Also not a one off its also followed by several more during the course of the day.Would be gratefull for anyones help thankyou.

What stock was that on and when?

It looks like a correction.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/general-election-2015/10838376/European-elections-Tories-leap-ahead-of-Ukip.html

European elections: Tories leap ahead of Ukip
David Cameron's Conservatives have overtaken Ukip and are now in second place behind Labour in the latest ICM/Telegraph European election poll, as voters prepare to cast their ballots on Thursday

The Conservatives have overtaken the UK Independence Party in the polls ahead of this week’s European Parliament elections.

The Tories are now in second place behind Labour in the contest to elect MEPs across Britain on Thursday, according to ICM/Sunday Telegraph results.

Labour is still in first place, but down one point to 29 per cent, the Conservatives are up four points to 26 per cent and Ukip has dropped two points to 25 per cent. The Liberal Democrats are on 7 per cent.

Martin Boon, director of ICM Research, said the volatile polling in recent weeks showed the European elections were wide open.

“Usually, polls give a pretty clear picture of what’s going to happen at any major election. Not so here. Labour could win, as could the Tories, or maybe Ukip,” he said.

ICM’s separate Wisdom Index poll put the Tories on 31.4 per cent, to Labour’s 30.7 per cent.

The slim lead of 0.7 points follows two polls last week which showed David Cameron’s party with a two-point advantage over Labour, his first poll lead since 2012.

The Liberal Democrats are on 15.1 per cent in the latest ICM results, ahead of the UK Independence Party on 13.4 per cent.

Trends and changes in the Wisdom Index ratings, which ask respondents to predict the next election result, tend to be less dramatic than conventional polls, which ask individuals how they personally intend to vote.

However, a clear pattern has emerged of declining support for Labour in recent weeks.

The previous ICM/Sunday Telegraph Wisdom Index survey, published on May 4, showed Labour’s lead cut to just one point. It has now disappeared.

Did someone mention leaping Tories?

UKIP will poll must votes in the Euro's

Voters are not going to put up with this anymore

Asylum seekers are put in 4-star hotels - at the cost of £900,000 from taxpayers

ASYLUM seekers have been secretly housed in luxury hotels at a cost to taxpayers of £900,000.

What a load of desperate bollox in that torygraph article:


Martin Boon, director of ICM Research, said the volatile polling in recent weeks showed the European elections were wide open.

“Usually, polls give a pretty clear picture of what’s going to happen at any major election. Not so here. Labour could win, as could the Tories, or maybe Ukip,” he said.

or maybe Ukip,” he said , in other words he hasn't a clue. But we all know UKIP are going to win.

The point being made was that it is anybody's election.

my major concern with ukip and their meps, and no one has gainsaid this, is that once elected they contribute absolutely zero to any debate, but merely fill their wallets with tax-free salary and expenses

therefore, without being party-biased about it, what on earth is the point of voting for ukip at all other than as a protest vote to proclaim that "i want out" regardless and without any further debate on the matter

cynic
I agree. It is completely pointless to vote for UKIP in the EU election. All it will do is decrease our influence in Europe. This is particularly pointless as even if we get a referendum, it looks like the public will vote to stay in.