Thought I'd start a new thread as this is going to be a major talking point this year...have not made up my mind yet...(unlike bucksfizz)....but thinking of voting for an exit as Europe is not doing Britain any good at all it seems....

Manuel.

Sense from you at last.
I thought you had a little somewhere or other, even if it is sometimes well hidden.

-=-=

Changes in a developing or dynamic institution are always necessary, but evolution is preferable to revolution.

I hope that the UK hasn't blown it.

But the majority of the present political leadership is failing the country.

May, maybe the best tory leader, but strange how some of the right wingers have fled the scene.

unfortunately, i cannot or indeed could not see any way in which the eu plutocrcay would have moved one centimetre had there not been a strong "out" vote ....
indeed, had "out" not won the day against all odds, i have my doubts that their minds would have been concentrated at all

This was posted earlier across the road, sums it up imo.



maximoney1
2 Jul'16 - 22:43 - 179462 of 179465 2 0


Christ, if the somme anniversary tributes dont get through to them the importance of democracy, what will. The crazy thing is, we are actually fighting for the younger generation and they dont even know it. The destruction of democracy is going to have less impact on the grumpy old men age group than it will have on the younger generation, that still have their whole working lives ahead of them and of course their children. It is only because grumpy old men realise the real importance of democracy that they fight for it at all....really think at times, why feckin bother....the young pay the ultimate price.

The lies unfold:

The knife was sharp!

.

In Peter Hitchens column in the Mail on Sunday, he says T. May is a
Blairite Robot...

And i couldn't agree more, she's just another establishment stooge..

Come on, Andrea!

Come on!

"We need a clean break and a fresh face. Andrea was the breakout star of the Leave campaign during the referendum: calm, assured and, in contrast to May and Gove, honest; putting the case for Brexit eloquently and passionately."

article 50
what advantage is there in invoking this asap?
as far as i can see, none whatsoever

while it is still in the background, all sorts of discussions can and i am sure will be held discretely and in private

once invoked, the clock starts ticking inexorably, and as i asked, to what advantage?

exit.

so you really think we'll draw up the drawbridge on europe?

i think not, and it would be very stupid indeed to shut (all) doors ....... i take it you're not in biz for yourself or you might and indeed should know that truism

I agree that there is no case for invoking Art. 50 at this time. The first thing is to choose a PM that is really committed to Brexit and will whip the negotiating team into shape. Preliminary discussions with and without Europe need to take place and there has to be a solid plan B, if, as expected, the EU plays hard ball. On reflection, after looking at the respective CVs, Andrea does seem to be the one.

Who said anything about drawbridges?

I thought you was neutral c?


And where is the tory party spokesman today?

Perhaps he can explain why anyone would go for lady Macbeth?

The Brexit team needs to examine a relatively few areas that will hurt the EU, particularly Germany and France, if it plays hard ball. Viable alternatives need to be in place. Cars and agricultural products come to mind but I'm sure there are bulk industrial materials that will hurt certain countries also.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jul/03/eu-swiss-single-market-access-no-free-movement-citizens

The European Union is to show its determination to make no concessions to the UK on Brexit terms by telling Switzerland it will lose access to the single market if it goes ahead with plans to impose controls on the free movement of EU citizens.

The Swiss-EU talks, underway for two years but now needing a solution possibly within weeks, throws up the exact same issues that will be raised in the UK’s exit talks – the degree to which the UK must accept free movement of the EU’s citizens as a price for access to the single market.

The UK should prepare draft legislation to ban new diesel cars. They are the worst polluters and better alternatives are available such as hybrid cars, electric and just plain petrol. It just so happens that it will seriously hit makers such as BMW and VW at the same time.

Ho yes lets believe and succumb to everything the guardian prints...

Seeing as it's a PRO-EU open door liberal bleeding heart propaganda sheet..

There could be an agreement where the UK would except migrants that have
the skills the country needs, and not just some roma gypsy who comes here
for the benefits to send home so they can build palatial villa's or extensions
to their properties, and also putting a stop on 'skilled' car washers.

Not just the Guardian, plenty of other news media reorting the same.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-britain-eu-swiss-idUSKCN0ZH48K

It is just going to be Brexit-lite.

Its only going to be Brexit-Lite if they go into the negotiations telling
the opposition that its going to be Brexit-Light, very similar to cameron
when he went into the 'reform' negotiations, and came back with zilch!

That's why there MUST be a 'firm' team of LEAVERS to do the negotiations,
otherwise there will be a capitulation even before they start..

I'm all for having WTO trade and tariffs agreements if it means stopping
the free movement of unskilled immigrants..

IT'S A RED LINE AS FAR AS I'M CONCERNED!!..

I doubt that it will be a red line in the end for the negotiators. It looks pretty certain that a remain candidate will be PM. My hunch is that May will win and she will appoint Andrea Leadsom to be part of the exit team. Farage won't be in it that's for sure.