Thought I'd start a new thread as this is going to be a major talking point this year...have not made up my mind yet...(unlike bucksfizz)....but thinking of voting for an exit as Europe is not doing Britain any good at all it seems....

Well listening to some, it would appear that there is going to be a fall guy by
the name of J.C. Juncker(the drunk), in an effort to make the EU come across
more amiable and less federalist, which would only be illusionary, and designed
to lull us into a false sense of security....

Of course, but it may work.

i remain amused and bemused about the ongoing nonsense still pervading the media about a 2nd referendum being held

The queues are already kicking off from countries around the world, who are keen to do some business with us:

11 countries gearing up to strike trade deals with Britain

k/news/2016/07/03/rupert-murdoch-nigel-farage-and-dr-liam-fox-meet-at-a-garden-par/

hTTp://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/07/03/angela-merkel-to-oust-jean-claude-juncker-as-europe-splits-deepe/

Both nicked from over the road.

4136
I like the offer to trade footballers from Iceland. Done deal but really we have none to send their way. Maybe they will take a two for one deal with a free duvet cover thrown in.

Just out of interest - is this George Osborne chappie (the one who wants to lower corporation tax), the same buffoon that was telling us taxes would have to rise if we voted Brexit?

Or just an ironic co-incidence?

All the histrionics of the referendum apart, I think Gideon has actually been a good chancellor. He went in to bat for his boss and we for our opinions. We won. Time now to get on with governing the country again with a PM committed to Brexit.

Helping friends?

stop being grumpy fred ..... sulking just because you aren't on the christmas card list will not help you in any way

===============

why did farage chuck in the sponge?
surely not just because he has no support in parliament?

"It is clear that it is the (German) government's aim that the issue of taxes is dealt with in a fair way in the single market," he said, adding that Berlin was waiting to see whether Osborne would present his plans to European finance ministers.


WTF should he?
even while we are/were in EU, we do not have to get brussels approval for our tax regime ........ even VAT levels are different within the member states

Just in from my 'Money Morning' e-mail subscription:

France doesn’t like the EU any more than we do

I think it’s fair to say that most British people would view France as being at the heart of the EU. That’s a) because it is, and b) because when we think of Europe, with both its culture and sophistication, and its bureaucracy and other flaws, is summed up in a semi-mythical vision of France.

Yet when it comes to the EU, the French are almost as ambivalent about it as we are. As Philippe Le Corre noted in the Financial Times the other day, there’s a good chance that France “will follow the UK and become a gravedigger of the European project”.

Opinion polls show that 61% of French people “hold unfavourable views of the EU”. Two-thirds feel that ”the EU has failed them economically”. By contrast to the UK, it’s the young who have been among the hardest hit, with massively high unemployment. “It is likely that they would vote for “Frexit” in a referendum”, says Le Corre.

Given that, it’s no surprise that anti-EU politicians – most notably, Marine Le Pen of the Front National – are growing more popular in France. But it’s not just the far right. The far left Front de Gauche (the clue’s in the name, I guess) has said that Brexit is “first and foremost the failure of the German government, of capitalism, and of successive subservient French governments”.

With a presidential election coming next May, Europe and the country’s relationship with the EU is bound to be a major issue.

Of course, France’s drastic unemployment levels are probably more to do with the country’s restrictive labour policies as they are the fault of the euro. But without the release valve of a flexible currency all of these underlying structural flaws become more apparent.

In an ideal world, that’s not necessarily a bad thing – one argument for having “hard” money is that it forces structural adjustments that should eventually make an economy more productive. But out there in the real world, those structural adjustments fall prey to special interest groups and politics.

That in turn makes it very hard for a politician to balance national and supranational interests. Eventually the choice between the two becomes too stark, and when that happens, it’s the supranational interests that will lose every time.

That’s before we even start talking about the Italians, who apparently are on the verge of telling the EU where to stick its rules on bank bailouts.

Brexit is an opportunity to create a better EU

The point is this: Brexit may seem like a catastrophe for the EU, but when you compare it to some of the other problems heading their way, it’s nothing.

A pragmatic EU (and I firmly believe that there are plenty of pragmatists in the EU – it’s hard to become a top politician if you lack that quality) would figure out a way to use this opportunity.

Yes, you can stick two fingers up to the impudent, unhelpful Brits. But what are you going to do when the Italians – who share your core currency – decide that they want to leave? What’ll you do when the French – one half of the Franco-German heart of the EU – decide that they’ve had enough?

I’d take this chance to work on a plan that keeps them all sweet, to create a more forgiving EU that genuinely works together to create a harmonious relationship between the states.

The sort of EU that would give Greece free rein to leave the euro but offer debt forgiveness and massive financial support for the new drachma. The sort of EU that feels secure enough in its existence that it doesn’t feel it has to steamroll over any and all objections from the citizens of Europe. The sort of EU that sees the voters as its primary concern, rather than an inconvenience.

The sort of EU that any country would want to be part of, in other words.

Can they get to that point? It seems a tall order. But we’ve got more than two years to make a few steps in that direction. And between now and then, France, Italy and all the other potential rebels in the EU are not just going to sit and behave until Britain has been dealt with.

After Brexit, theres' no reason why we can't continue with this.....

It's a sad day to hear of Nigel Farage's resignation, UKIP won't be the
same without him.

Without Nigel Farage there wouldn't have been a referendum...


WELL DONE NIGEL FARAGE!!!

It is a shame that he has left. While he was leader it was even easier to dislike UKIP.

Rubbish, Haystack.

Nigel was a phenominal anti-EU orator, 'telling it how it is' and got pretty poor support from the two senior UK political parties whilst he was compl]aining about the negatives of the EU.

For instance, here is Nigel Farage explaining the pathetic anti-democratic appointment of Jean-Claude Juncker:

He is a rabble rouser and racist. I dislike him intensely. His immigration poster showed what he is like.

as with fred, it's very easy to rant and rave when you have no one to answer to