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ProselenesI have a holding here can I sell in HK from uk or do I have to transfer 1st
Thanx

You have to transfer, as per the link above and the information on the web site.

It takes roughly 6 working days to go through the process, to have your stock on the Hang Seng and able to sell there.

Arbitrage will happen, however it will take time. Given the "6 working day" lag to move stock to the Hang Seng, the ability to not be able to trade your holdings for 6 days while this process goes through will be a "risk too much" for some people and instiutions.

So I do expect the process of the prices coming within 5% of each to take time, time that is where brokers in London happily buy stock from lazy PI's and short term traders willing to sell, and then move that stock and sell for a significant profit in Hong Kong.

The net effect will be less and less stock on the AIM, and more and more on the Hang Seng, and that will eventually level the prices to within say 5% IMO.

RCG have done this right IMV, by listing as a pure introduction, and allowing the Hang Seng to create demand, that will be filled by AIM selling. That was the big positive when news came that no new shares were being issued.

RCG is in the headlines in Hong Kong for two reasons, one being the big rises, and the second being Tony Chan and the Nina Wang holdings.

This creates some spice, and lots of media coverage.

Again, I say RCG have done the right thing by not issuing the results too soon, they have allowed the listing to happen, allowed the people to get to know RCG more by it being in the headlines, and now, when all eyes are looking, they can within the coming weeks issue results, and that should be the key for a very large dose of investor interest and buying, provided the results and outlook are as good as hoped.

So, for those willing to wait, I think we can be sure that whilst those willing to sell take quick profits, those willing to hold should be rewarded far more, as the AIM prices rises as more and more stock is transfered over to the Hang Seng.

Again, the coming results are the next major key event for me, and one which should generate many multiples of the present buying interest.

Bring it on, fingers crossed :)

Decent volume, over 10m taking in all exchanges. This should clear out the long term sellers on the AIM market who had caused the price to crash down.

There will be lots of noise over RCG, there has to be, simply as its highlighting just how bad the UK AIM market is, telling the whole world there is little liquidity there, there are very few buyers and its quite possibly one of the worst places in the world to have your company listed.

Now, before we all say how bad AIM is, the main reason for this is seen by outsiders are lack of regulatory process, exec's "getting away with murder" and other such nasties that can leave shareholders well and truly in the lurch. AIM was a market for "the unlimited credit times" - just have an idea and raise a few million and nobody cares if the company goes into the ground 12 months after listing. In the "credit crunch" times AIM is a market that just has "leftovers" on the table, and there is no appetite for them, and they are starting to go mouldy.

And before all the "Chinese stock rampers" start on about GNG, TAIH, CHNS and other dross listed on AIM and how they will "all go up" - we have to look more in detail at RCG.

RCG did a very non-AIM thing, they decided to list on the Hang Seng, a market that requires much higher levels of corporate compliance, with much more regulation - all the opposites of what AIM was using to get companies to list.

Many companies on AIM could not list on the Hang Seng, without some very major changes, changes which might expose a few skeletons in cupboards.

So now we are at "noise level high".

When RCG was trading at 150p I called it down, and went long at 32p - thats all very well documented over at TMF etc.

Note that when RCG fell from 150p to 30p there was little "media coverage, nobody cared.

Now that they are moving up fast, more and more is coming in owing to it highlighting just how bad the London AIM is for valuing companies. This does not mean that AIM will value other companies any different in future, thats not the way it works, what it does show is that good companies who are willing to be subjected to high levels of corporate compliance and strict regulation, will find their valuations grealty enhanced by listing on a main exchange.

It may mean the "end is nigh" for AIM, but so be it, you live by the sword and die by it.

Away from AIM and on to RCG, we will likely see lots of "how can this be" kind of posts, we will see lots of posts from short term traders trying to justify their sells, lots of people trying to justify to themselves why they took profits, and in general lots of nonsense written about RCG.

Firstly, owing to the rise they had to issue mandatory "no known reason for the rise" releases, one was released earlier on the Hang Seng, and later one on AIM too. This complete compliance, they have said no known reason apart from HK listing - you cannot exactly say "the company was valued at peanuts by a bunch of tossers in London and now its getting its value back" - can you ?

If we look at the company :

Its growing fast.
It has net cash.
Its paying a divi.
Its listed on an exchange with high levels of corporate governance (HKex that is)

A long term value investor should be happy to pay 15 times historic earnings for that and hold for future growth.

When results come out, earnings should be well over 2HK$ a share, or over 20p a share in UK monies.

Value investors therefore are right to buy this up to around 37HK$, or circa 300p a share.

Nowt wrong with the company, just been listed in the wrong place (AIM) for far too long.

And so ultimately, we come back to UK in general, pumped up house prices on pure credit fantasy, banks with no money but lots of debt, personal debt at well over a trillion pounds and a junior index, the AIM market, that was the playground (or was that payground) of anyone taking advantage of easy credit. Its now left with many companies that cannot list elsewhere, stuck forever in a place said to be "nothing more than a casino" by many around the world, and they will suffer with very low valuations for a very long time to come.

I say now, do not value RCG on what you perceive the AIM would value it as (although until we eliminate some of the leftover UK fundies needing cash urgently their continued selling will keep the value of AIM lower than HK, but only until they are gone), value it as you would a FTSE 250 stock, with the level of earnings it has, with the cash it has, with the divi it pays and with the growth its seeing.

As it stands now, its cheap on the Hang Seng at 25HK$, and very very very cheap on AIM, and lets get results out to highlight this and bring in more and more long term value investors. The transition has started, its going to take time, but it will happen, and before too long the majority of the companies stock will be on the Hang Seng, and not AIM.........IMV.

All IMO, DYOR etc.. !!

As of Tuesday we now have the HK listing and the shares have mushroomed. However the HK pice is at present 23HK$, which equates to 2, whilst AIM is quoted as 78p. What is going on and when will we get some parity? It must stabilise this week surely? Problem is the share has been far too lowly rated on AIM and HK investors obviously love it. But should one buy more shres on AIM?

Seems to have fallen to HK$16 after profit taking?

Nothing goes up in a straight line, always will be profit taking and pull backs.

Thats why the results statement is the next big key driver for RCG.

For those who want to see standard Hang Seng P/E's, and remember this is the average, not the extremes, and RCG fall into being "profitble, cash in the bank, growing" and so should be well ahead of the "average".

http://main.hsi.com.hk/hsicom/table/MnPEHSI.html

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http://www.investegate.co.uk/Article.aspx?id=200902130700082466N

One of the directors taking up a buy of options, 400,000 of them at 136p each.

Thats a lot of money, and he could have purchased them cheaper on the London market, so one could speculate he must be confident of the future of the company..........

I reckon parity in the share price will be reached next week, otherwise most AIM shareholders will switch their listing to Hong Kong, which takes six days. Perhaps many institutional holders have already done so. AIM share price rising as I speak.

jab1tt

But if they switch and sell them over there, then the HK price will drop to fall more in line with the AIM I'D thought rather than the other way round.

That's possible but my point is that there will have to be parity shortly. I should think that such a disparity in the share price is virtually unknown and it does appear that the company will get a much higher rating in HK, bolstered by good results. If the higher rating in HK persists, AIM will have to come into line.

jab1tt

Well, for those who do not beleive the IT sector, of which high tech RCG belongs really, cannot trade at 30 times and 40 times earnings, here is the chart of IT PER ratios on the Hang Seng.

Patience and wait.......might be a year or two, but just think about the gains as Hang Seng takes over and drives the price up as more and more stock is transferred over there (taking it the company continue to do fine of course)

http://main.hsi.com.hk/hsicom/table/mnpehsciit.html

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pp do we have a date for final results announcement, in previous years it has been either end of feb or around mid march?

Thinks its going to be mid-March.

Allow time for HK institurions and brokers to extract stock from AIM, transfer over to Hong Kong......and then be ready to feed lots of new buyers on excellent results.

This will help even up the 2 exchanges, as less stock will be on AIM.

pp tks, do you know what the free float is ignoring Madam Wang's estate shareholding?

Presently I would guesstimate its around 40%, and most of that on AIM.

What we need, and what hopefully happened last week, is Hong Kong brokers and institutions started buying on AIM, and will be, in the coming weeks, transferring it over to the Hang Seng.

The price differential makes it good business for them, and with results mid-March, there should be plenty of buying demand to sell it into.

From the South China Morning Post - looks like RCG is getting some media attention both here and in Hong Kong/China.

Very interesting to get the news from the other side of the globe Proselenes - thanks!

Some industry news on the RCG site :


http://www.rcg.tv/html/eng/about/newsroom/industry_news/biometrics/2009_details_11.jsp

Over 60 countries issuing e-passport

15 February 2009, 23:00:00

By the end of 2008, over 60 countries have been issuing e-passport. The issuing of new e-passports was the initiative to replace existing travel documents in order to store additional information such as digital photographs and biometrics. The first country that issued e-passport was Malaysia in 1998, with other countries following in 2004. The last country to issue e-passport was Taiwan on 30 December 2008. Looking into 2009, a number of countries had already announced their initiative of issuing new e-passports, including: Canada, Croatia, India, The Philippines, Israel, Botswana and South Africa. New projects involve replacement of traditional passports, upgrade of existing e-passports to include biometric information and performance optimization. It is expected that more countries will adopt e-passports containing biometrics in the near future for improved border security. Source: findbiometrics; 2009 ePassport status: 60+ countries now issuing (30th December, 2008)


http://www.rcg.tv/html/eng/about/newsroom/industry_news/biometrics/2009_details_10.jsp

Airport in 2016 is a combination of Mobile Communications and biometrics

15 February 2009, 23:00:00

Gadling, a website specializing in travel-related news has featured an article on the prediction of future airports. The author believed that biometrics and Near Field Communications (NFC) will be the dominant technologies, whereas biometrics is for airport and border security, NFC is for boarding passes embedded to mobile phones. Fingerprints and Iris recognition technologies are expected to dominate in airports for more convenient measures for border security. The author predicted that mobile phone boarding passes will undergo trials in 2009, whereas the fundamental infrastructure will be ready by 2011. The nationwide biometrics database may be realized at a later date, but larger projects in biometrics may be readily initiated by the private sector for more convenient authentication for checkpoints. Source: gadling; The future at the airport involves your phone, fingers and eyes (December 26th, 2008)


http://www.rcg.tv/html/eng/about/newsroom/industry_news/rfid_news/2009_details_11.jsp

RFID for monitoring glass bottles manufacturing

15 February 2009, 23:00:00

There has been an initiative in Britain to encourage manufacturers to lighten the load of the glass bottles used for food and beverages. The Waste andamp; Resources Action Programme caused problems to the manufacturers as glass bottles may break as a result of less glass used. RFID technology was adopted to solve the problem and the solution was introduced and provided to manufacturers which intend to follow the initiative. An RFID chip with sensors was placed in a glass bottle throughout the manufacturing process. As the bottle passed through various checkpoints, staff with the hand-held interrogators extract information from the RFID chip and the data was sent back to a centralized database for further analysis. The pressure, impacts and temperature experienced by the tagged bottle were monitored. Weak points were easily identified and the process can be further optimized to achieve a balance between breakages and efficiency. Source: rfidjournal; Smart Bottles Reduce Glass Breakage (Dec 29th, 2008)


http://www.rcg.tv/html/eng/about/newsroom/industry_news/rfid_news/2009_details_12.jsp

Jewellery retailer adopting RFID for security

15 February 2009, 23:00:00

A Jewellery retailer in India has recently completed a trial for the use of RFID to enhance security and improve inventory management for their products. Passive RFID tags were used for less expensive products and active RFID tags were used for luxurious items. RFID readers were installed within the store located in New Delhi for regular monitoring of store inventories. As part of the infrastructure, readers were installed in both the ceiling and under the floor at the exit. It will alert the store owner if the tags were removed, disabled or positioned out of range via email or text message. 100 percent security was said to be achieved by using RFID in the store, error rate was also minimized as a result of better visualization of inventory status. After the success of the trial, the company expects to adopt RFID for tracking in all of its stores located in other parts of India. Source: rfidjournal; Indian Jeweler Seeks 100 Percent Security From RFID (Dec 30th, 2008)