I am afraid TFC and myself rather highjacked the CHP thread on this subject, so have started a proper one.

Will cut and paste as necessary from CHP, where our opposing stances are self-apparent

Just thought.

Although I mentioned this was O/T its not really.

Have the great imported footballers like Henry, Renaldo and that big fat lad at Chelsea (the forward) enriched our lifes etc, etc.?????????.

Come on Cynic first one for you in the morning and Ive given you a great opening here, just like a Ballack through ball (when hes not injured or shagging)???.

Harrycat,

You were talking about Brit's retiring to Spain,
The Brit's who retire to Spain have paid into the NHS via 40 years of N I contributions and are more entiteled then anybody else for free treatment

Spot on aldwickk.

If thats correct i'm about to defect to the murky underworld of the costa's, Where my kids will be donned in burburries finest.

Although the costa del crime would not be my choice of retirement the English pats have probably also contributed more to the Spanish coffers than the indigenous population .From turning scrubland into beautiful villas thearby stimulating the entire building industry from bricklayers, joiners, plumbers to surveyors and architects Also pumping money into the local eateries/ bars and entertainment sector .Plus the retail sector and provision of jobs for locals - the list is endless And thats merely the tip of the iceburg ....Basically responsible for dragging Spain into the 21st century ,,,,,,,,and Spain is grateful ,,,,,,,,,,And as aldwick points out this is after 40 years of restrictive progressive taxation in the UK ...................Without them it would be no more than a banana republic growing oranges and sugar beet for the rest of Europe ....Ever been to Barcalona ?? Try your very best to avoid it ./,,,...lts a shithole with more junkies and thieves per square metre than anywhere in Europe....Rather like Bradford, Leeds and Liverpool and London ---unfortunately ....@+ J

GF. check out KMR. I know your into them.

up 3.5 last time i looked ...But who isnt into them >? lol

I sold out @49.08

we are beggining to think alike R .....im looking to sell also .....jump back in on retracement

So, FC, the brits on the Costa Brava "have turned scrubland into beautiful villas "(Yeah right!), have "dragged Spain in to the 21st century" otherwise "it would be a banana republic growing oranges & sugarbeet" & "Barcelona is a shithole".?
I bet you're one of those guys who wish the good ol' days of the British Empire were back. Sadly now, instead of owning two thirds of the globe, we now piss off two thirds of the world (including Spain) with our poor attitudes, poor manners & feeble achievments.
And for all you guys who keep comparing modern imported footballers with good british talent, the only past brits you have mentioned are dead!!! Come on guys, move with the times.

Harrycat,

I wouldn't say your attitude is anything to shout about.

What are these feeble achievments ?

Why are you still living here, you don't seem to have a good word to say about the people or the country.

this all seems to have gone totally off subject, but no matter ...... footie? .... no comment .... i don't follow it but would have enjoyed last night's match had i been around ...... Spain? ..... forget the slanging between you guys .... a very interesting article in today's Telegraph about the collapse of the Spanish housing market, and not just jerry-built structres either! ... well worth the read

The difference is, aldwickk, I am still here trying to help put things right & not jumping ship when things get a little bit difficult.
I am a white indigenous brit, but I find that many of my countrymen behave badly at home & abroad, & also live with the memory of past achievments (1966 World Cup etc etc) instead of moving forward with the times.
Feeble achievments: F1 All british drivers underperforming (Lewis Hamilton to prove himself); Cricket World Cup underperformed; Last footy World cup, well we didn't win that either; Olypics, Moto GP, Golf majors, Tennis etc etc.
Of course, Britain does excel at other things which get less publicity, but it's the high profile sport which we so desperately want to be good at.
Just another thought - It's interesting to note, on the subject of immigrants, how many british boxers, past & present have come from ethnic minority groups; Where would british boxing be without Amir Khan?

or Kid Lewis in 30s (I think) .....nice Jewish boy who loved his mother! ..... + a few similar who ended up in Chicago slugging it out with Capone (native born American of course) and his ilk

And here is another difference.
I am a keen (but very bad) sportsman. Cricket, Golf, Football, even tiddlywinks if I think there may be a pint afterwards. Give me the choice between being a nation that is crap at sport and ranked beside San Marino or my countrys proud and distinguished heritage being left untouched by the liberal minority and I will happily accept never going to a major championships again, and having a serious pi$$ up when we win a bronze at the olympic synchronised swimming!!
My childrens future is far more important to me than whether we can cut it at Augusta or Las Vegas, and I fear for their future in a nation where being part of the indiginous population can disadvantage you and retrict your voice and opinion.
Alan

Alan .... as i wrote earlier, i too disagree with postive discrimination and open-door immigation and several other relevant bits ..... however, and i suspect you concur, there is a Grand Canyon between that and some of the bigotted, blind prejudice and neo-Nazi views that have been expressed on this thread.

given that the law is ultimately just a reflection of the society we live in, i suspect quite strongly that some of the current excessively liberal (don't really want to use that word, but can think of no other) laws and rules will be modified within (say) the next 5 years or earlier if we are lucky.

unfortunately, for such is the nature of things, it is equally likely that some time down the line (15/20 years?) the pendulum will have swung too far towards authoritarianism etc ..... and so the cycle will continue

ohhhhh NO !!!!!!!!!....l have recently been informed l have blackies in my family tree ,,,,,,,,But its perfectly ok with me . They have been hanging there for over 3 weeks ...lolol Merely a joke to introduce a little levity into such a serious issue; and not wishing to start a trend in anti immigrant jokes ...........Harry. Lest you have not noticed l am not English.Prepped and schooled here but born in Brive-La- Gaillarde.l dont give a toss about the British empire...lmressed by it- but not inclined to really think about it. ..Ditto reg. the French empire in Africa, lndo China, and the middle east. .......................................................On a more serious note i passed a social security office recently in Deptford. And was shocked by the number of blacks who claim benefit who drive hi-performance vechicles. Now these offices have cameras patently visible on the exterior so how is it that these people are not caught for claiming benefit fraudulently ........or are you English running scared of these criminals ? ln addition a barrister friend of mine told me of some blackie he prosecuted for Armed Robbery at the CCC .This crime has a usual tarrif of 8 years to Life imp. But the Judge was also a black and sentanced him to 18 months imprisonment .Had the man been white he would have received 7-12 years . lnevitably my friend immediately filed an application of leave to appeal on the grounds of inadequacy of sentance . This was later granted with the presiding Justice remarking that the original judge should be reported to the LC s office for patently having an agenda more befitting of racism turned on its head and reeked of cronyism ((Very rare for a brother judge to appear so critical of another .Well so says Michael Mansfield who is a neighbor of mine ))...Cant tell you what the appeal Justice said off the record but what on earth is a pickerninny ( ??) as i cant find in English dictionary..............@+ J

Plus you English hardly have room to talk .l wont go into it ....But when the Jews were being persucuted by Hitlers demented motley bunch as early as 1935 , l dont recall the English accepting applications for British citizenship made on behalf of the aforementioned Jewish peoples ..........l often wonder why ?.........Unlike King Peter of Sweden who himself wore the yellow star in an illustration of his support of the Jewish peoples . ...........

TFC,
Pickerninny. I believe (though I stand to be corrected) that it was a word first created and used by J M Barrie in his novel Peter Pan. It was the name of a tribe of Indians in Never Never Land and the name was chosen to portray a sense of stupidity (Pick-A-Ninny, ninny being a word to describe a foolish person).
The word has been used (infrequently) to describe someone as foolish, though one could argue it has racial undertones as the tribe was Indian.
Think thats right. Hope it helps.
Alan

Alan . As always -very helpful .A positive font of knowledge . Thank you for both the definition and its real origins. . /...l think in this case the noun was employed in dual fashion. Both foolish and foreign ..........18 months for armed robbery .? What next ? Hardly a deterant, and morelike, a positive endorsement/ green light , to commit one of the most serious crimes in the criminal calander without rightful punishment .................................