Thought I'd start a new thread as this is going to be a major talking point this year...have not made up my mind yet...(unlike bucksfizz)....but thinking of voting for an exit as Europe is not doing Britain any good at all it seems....

re - their own demented arguments

are you talking about - Freda - or - Soros -?

anyway they are both from the same background Communists East European, both refuges and the same old age.

soros was born in hungary in 1930, which was far from being either communist or east european and came to uk in 1947
by a narrow definition, yes a refugee but the other "accusations" are well off the mark

You can include yourself in the list if you feel happy - cynic

and then you can say ..... is talking about me

There is no "accusations" just truth 3 yes

Communists East European - Hungary - yes
refugee - yes
old age - 87 - yes

nope ..... you already know my family history so won't bother to repeat

hungary was not "gifted" to the russkies until 1949
though it fell under it's own communist gov't earlier in the century, it did not have great public support
for sure the period from about 1920 was very messy (and bloody)

middle european yes; eastern european no

NOPE to you

If Poland is considered as Eastern Europe, Hungary is just below on the same line

It's generally considered Eastern European. Anything east of Germany is.
Most will say : I've never heard anyone talk about "central" European, or is East or West

The United Nations Statistics Division considers Eastern Europe to consist of the following ten countries: Belarus, Bulgaria, Czech Republic, Hungary, Moldova, Poland, Romania, Russia (a transcontinental country), Slovakia, Ukraine.


The 2007 Time Almanac defines Eastern Europe as the following 24 countries: Albania, Armenia, Azerbaijan, Belarus, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Bulgaria, Croatia, Czech Republic, Estonia, Georgia, Greece, Hungary, Latvia, Lithuania, Republic of Macedonia, Moldova, Montenegro, Poland, Romania, Russia, Serbia, Slovakia, Slovenia, Ukraine

Listen to Eastern Europe ( Poland, Hungary, and the Czech Republic )
by MICHAEL BRENDAN DOUGHERTY June 19, 2017 4:00 AM

EU bureaucrats should hear the message loud and clear: Muslim migration waves are a pressing problem, and the public is fed up. The European Union announced this week that it would begin proceedings to punish Poland, Hungary, and the Czech Republic for their refusal to accept refugees and migrants under a 2015 scheme the E.U. commission created.

The mission’s aim was to relieve Greece and Italy of the burden from migrant waves arriving from the Middle East and Africa, largely facilitated by European rescues of migrants in the Mediterranean. The conflict between the EU and these three nations of the Visegrád Group is not just about the authority the EU can arrogate to itself when facing an emergency (one largely of its own making), but about the character of European government and society in the future. It is hard not to conclude that the dissenting countries are correct to dissent. Hungary, the Czech Republic, and Slovakia had voted against the 2015 agreement. Poland’s government had supported it then, but a subsequent election saw a new party come into power that rejected the scheme.

The Eastern European governments are right to reject the farcical 2015 scheme. First because it is based on so many lies. Western Europe’s policy on “refugees” has been dishonest from beginning to end. The vast majority of people arriving are not fleeing war in Syria or Iraq. They are coming from Chad, Afghanistan, and Eritrea, and they are looking for economic opportunity in Europe.

http://www.nationalreview.com/article/448749/sanctions-punishing-poland-eastern-europe-are-mistake

Can't argue about that. The migrants were encouraged by ships standing by to pick them up and take them to their destination. Including British but not Polish or Hungarian. Let the EU take "proceedings". The alternative is clear to see in the rest of the EU.

hungary currently has a pretty scary far-right gov't
don't know where poland sits in that respect


European Union announced this week that it would begin proceedings to punish ......
if that is indeed true and it may well be, the it shows how little brussels bureaucrats have listened or are even willing to hear from their members

==============

fred - not quite fair i know, but it is an indicator (rather than a true example) of exactly why i voted "out" - ie i saw it as the only way to get brussels' attention

I always found walking away from a discussion when I wanted to influence the outcome was the best way to deal with problems.

Showed "grown up responsible behaviour", or was it "that will show "em"" adolescent behaviour of those with poor arguments.

I always found walking away from a discussion when I wanted to influence the outcome was the best way to deal with problems.

Showed "grown up responsible behaviour", or was it "that will show "em"" adolescent behaviour of those with poor arguments?

that's a rubbish argument in this particular :-)

Lib Dems: 12 seats
DUP: 10 seats

Tim Farron, the Lib Dem leader recently resigned the Leadership. Vince Cable, won back a seat at the Election and is 'up for it' to lead the party once again.

Let's hope he gets it. Vince has also said, that he is NOT going to be bound to follow Farron's vow NOT to do a deal with the Tories. I feel Vince might well be up for a Tory deal, particularly for a cabinet position.

Thoughts anyone?

that would certainly piss off corbyn :-)
i rate vince cable too, even though he doesn't work too well on the box

And pigs might fly.

I like Cable and majority of his views (which I know of) and think he will make a good leader of the Lib/Dems and might restore the party's following and support.

However, any "deal" with the "tories" would be the final nail in his party's coffin.

That does not mean he and his party will not support the policy votes in HP if they are agreeable to them.

But what policies do the tories have. The party is more split than in Major or Cameron's day, and the majority of the con MPS are not neofascists, but some who are trying to control the direction of the con party are.

Interesting to watch the tories tear themselves apart.


A bit like foxhunting!

and the labour party behind closed doors for a change

Fred, you bang on about being at discussions in order to influence decisions, Cameron tried and failed with his few meagre requests. There is no reasoning with Brussels you either do as they say or you get punished. Why would any country want to be part of that club.

27 other countries at the moment.

Plus a few who would wish to.

Life is give and take.

But the EU sees the UK as look, bluster, and attempt to take.

27 at the moment but for how long? You obviously have inside knowledge regarding how the EU sees the UK.

Doesn't seem likely that we will get much of a Brexit now.