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The really useful silver thread (AG)     

squirrel888 - 12 Jun 2013 10:30

><a href=5 Year HUI Index Chart - AMEX Gold Bugs Index Performance" alt="" /> ><a href=1 Year Gold to Silver Price Ratio Chart - Gold Silver Ratio Graph" alt="" />

WStirrup - 12 Jun 2013 13:20 - 8 of 1034

Subtle Squirrel...

BUT, I noticed this AM. on another web-site, who shall remain nameless, that you can post URLs if you use HTTP, not http. ;¬)

And they still work too... but no HTML means no images, or other references.

W.

snurkle1 - 12 Jun 2013 15:19 - 9 of 1034

Bill Holter's latest

http://blog.milesfranklin.com/what-a-complete-farce

snurkle1 - 12 Jun 2013 15:55 - 10 of 1034

Summarizing The Known Rigged Markets

Following last night's revelation that FX trading is the latest addition to the "rigged" column, here is a summary of the known market manipulation scandals (because it can be problematic keeping track of all by now):

•Libor - interest rates (link)
•ISDAfix - swaps (link)
•Platts - oil prices (link)
•WM/Reuters - FX (link)
•High-Frequency Trading - equities (link)
We also know that the Fed and world central banks are engaged in a full blown (and unprecedented) Treasury curve modeling exercise courtesy of both ZIRP (short-end) and QE (long-end), and that courtesy of some $12 trillion in extra liquidity in the past 5 years, stocks are at an artificial "weath effect" sugar high.

We can therefore deduce that, following the process of elimination, gold and silver are the only markets that are unmanipulated and where transparent price discovery is allowed to take place without intervention from key players.

Sarcasm off.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-06-12/summarizing-known-rigged-markets

gazkaz - 12 Jun 2013 17:23 - 11 of 1034

Hi the silver board

Following on from Snurkles list...evidence

Test link (using skinny's suggested) link option (above the posting post)

http://www.goldcore.com/goldcore_blog/banks-rig-47-trillion-day-currency-markets-profit-clients

The world’s biggest banks
- have been manipulating.... benchmark foreign-exchange rates
- used to set the value of trillions of dollars of investments,
- according to a Bloomberg investigation.

Employees have been front-running....... client orders
- and rigging..... WM/Reuters rates
- by pushing through trades before and during the 60-second windows when the benchmarks are set,
said ......five current and former traders,..... who requested anonymity because the practice is controversial.

Dealers colluded with counterparts to boost chances of moving the rates, said two of the people, who worked in the industry for a total of more than 20 years.

The behavior occurred daily in the spot foreign-exchange market and has been going on for at least a decade, affecting the value of funds and derivatives and all investments.

The Financial Conduct Authority, Britain’s markets supervisor, is considering opening a probe into potential manipulation of the rates, according to a person briefed on the matter.

gazkaz - 12 Jun 2013 17:27 - 12 of 1034

Squirrell - oh joy of joys (well done sweetheart)

- ability to post images/charts
(using the little top right piccy box above the posting box)

- and active links too
(just using the little chain piccy - above the posting box)

Simplicity itself (and I am a 'appy bunny again :o)

gazkaz - 12 Jun 2013 17:38 - 13 of 1034

Squirrel
- if you ...edit.... your very first post
- click the top right little picture above the posting box
- and delete the pre filled http in the pop up box
- then just copy & paste this in the pop up box

http://www.kitconet.com/charts/metals/silver/t24_ag_en_usoz_2.gif

(hopefully you should then get - a chart :o)



Voila

Add any others you feel appropriate

PS - you get the chart link - by right clicking - a chart you want on a web page
- then go down to the bottom - click properties
- hold left mouse key & highlight the "address" bit....within the "properties"
(thats the bit you paste in - this boards pop up box ....ensure you delete prefilled http - or you will get it twice....when you paste)

squirrel888 - 12 Jun 2013 19:56 - 14 of 1034

Did it - yipee!

If anyone else wants any other kind of chart in header just let me have instructions same as Gaz.

Cool - hope the rest of the gang join us.

squirrel888 - 12 Jun 2013 20:06 - 15 of 1034

That's better - feels more at home with the black kitco chart.

Any other requests - shall do my best to oblige.

Will post wealth daily & others as I find.

Happy silver folk. Lifted my heart today. Ty all. ;-)

snurkle1 - 12 Jun 2013 20:19 - 16 of 1034

well found and well executed.

Good to see you here too Gaz.

squirrel888 - 12 Jun 2013 20:34 - 17 of 1034

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-06-12/summarizing-known-rigged-markets

Snurks - that should make your link above live.

And your Bill Holter link too.

http://blog.milesfranklin.com/what-a-complete-farce

Just use the hyperlink - 2nd icon from the end - at the top of the post box. :-)

snurkle1 - 12 Jun 2013 20:36 - 18 of 1034

Regardless by whom the following article is written, it speaks for itself what we we're about to face.


Sprott's Thoughts
June 12, 2013



The Dijssel-Bomb
Eric Sprott and David Franklin (dfranklin@sprott.com)

This past March, Jeroen Dijsselbloem, the head of the finance ministers of the eurozone, shocked the markets with seemingly off-the-cuff comments suggesting that the Cyprus banking solution will, “serve as a model for dealing with future banking crises.”1 Depositors across Europe took a collective gasp of horror – could banks possibly confiscate depositors’ funds in a form of daylight robbery? Indeed they could, and last week the Bank for International Settlements (“BIS”), the Central Bank's Central Bank, published what we have referred to as ‘the template’; a blueprint outlining the steps to handle the failure of a major bank and the conditions to be met before ‘bailing-in’ deposits.

In their recently published paper “A Template For Recapitalising Too-Big-To-Fail Banks”, authors Paul Melaschenko and Noel Reynolds argue for a “simple” mechanism to recapitalize failed banks without the use of taxpayers' money. They propose a process whereby a bank, if it reached the point of failure, could transfer ownership to a newly created holding company over a weekend and be recapitalized. The bank would then be sold, enabling the market to determine the ultimate losses to previous equity holders and creditors. And, yes, this scenario includes losses for depositors above a guaranteed limit. Presto! A new bank with a clean balance sheet, ready to receive liquidity support from the prevailing central bank, without the need for handouts, bailouts, TARP programs, or any other form of government assistance. Previous debt and equity holders and depositors of this failed bank would be left with an equity position in the new entity. This ‘template’ would ensure that “shareholders and uninsured private sector creditors (read: depositors and bond holders) of such banks, rather than taxpayers, bear the cost of resolution.”2 While at the moment this framework is only outlined in a discussion paper, it confirms our suspicions. While the old template involved “bailing out” banks through the transfer of toxic assets from the corporate sector to the taxpayer, the new template calls for “bailing in”. In this model the risk is contained within the affected institution at the expense of equity holders, bond holders and finally depositors. Far from being an idle comment, the unscripted 'bomb' that Mr. Dijsselbloem dropped on the market during the Cyprus Banking crisis is on its way to becoming a reality across Europe and other major banking centers.

In our opinion, the problem with the banks stems from an over-levered banking system that still has not been brought under control. Traditionally, banks would “de-lever” by selling portions of their loan portfolios to other banks, but since 2008, this hasn’t happened in most instances and leverage has remained elevated. In fact, an example of a bank “bail-out” that highlights the over-leverage still plaguing the system, happened recently in Mr. Dijsselbloem’s own back-yard. In this instance, the Netherlands nationalized SNS Reaal, a banking and insurance group, in a $14 billion rescue that highlights the continued fragility of the European banking sector.

From The Wall Street Journal:

The government rescue was inevitable after SNS Reaal suffered a run on deposits and failed to raise capital on its own. “It is worrisome. Nearly the entire Dutch banking system is now on a government lifeline,” said Arnoud Boot, a professor of corporate finance at the University of Amsterdam. The Dutch state will inject €2.2 billion ($2.99 billion) into the company, write off €800 million from an earlier bailout and €700 million on the value of SNS Reaal's toxic property loans. It will also provide an additional €6.1 billion in loans and guarantees to put the firm on a sound footing. The burden to taxpayers will be eased somewhat through a €1 billion contribution from the other Dutch banks through a special levy.3

Can you see the pattern? Depositor runs triggered a bailout of an over-levered institution, leading to a write-off of toxic assets, additional lending and guarantees by the government. All of this committed to by Mr. Dijsselbloem on behalf of the Dutch people. This will likely be the last time we see a rescue in this fashion, for now we have a new ‘template’ whose prima facie case was Cyprus. It is interesting to note that, to the best of our knowledge, there was no discussion of “bail-ins” for Dutch depositors of SNS Reaal.

It is clear now that the crossing of the Rubicon into the confiscation of depositor funds was not a one-off emergency measure limited to Cyprus. We can only speculate as to what triggered these new rules. Perhaps the public would no longer tolerate the use of taxpayer-funds to effect bailouts of banks? Maybe this is the beginning of an attack on offshore banking havens? Or possibly the regulators are hoping to impose some market discipline on the banks, forcing depositors to review bank balance sheets before opening an account. Regardless of motivation this is a game changer.

So what is the impact of this ‘template’ for investors? By law, when you put your money into a deposit account, your money becomes a liability of the bank. Above an insured amount, you become an ‘unsecured creditor’ with a claim against the assets of a bank if it were to fail; your deposits are now pooled with other assets and divided amongst other creditors. We urge investors to consider any deposits above the insured amounts to be only as safe as the credit-worthiness and capital structure of the bank indicates. Only by understanding where you are in the creditor ‘pecking order’ will you avoid a ‘Dijssel-Bomb’ in the next phase of the on-going financial crisis.

gazkaz - 12 Jun 2013 22:19 - 19 of 1034

Snurkle - likewise (nice to be back amonst friends) & good to have a board with working links , pictures & charts again

- I think ftb I will tend to just post over here, just on this silver board

DoobyDave - 12 Jun 2013 22:29 - 20 of 1034

A gratuitous 'hello' from me :)
DD

gazkaz - 12 Jun 2013 22:41 - 21 of 1034

Well generally it's worth looking at as many permutations of future guesses
- from QE to infinity - through to global preparations for the "Cyprus Template"
- and expert thoughts and opinions

Someone has kindly put the legwork in and knocked up a chart based on his assessment of cycles over the last 25yrs......and where and when prices ....could be going
(based on his model)

Seems a reasonable test fit to actual (retrospectively).....but then again
- they didn't have plunge protection, full spectrum market manipulation, global central bank co-ordinated QE to infinity, manipulated near zero interest rates, near total ownership & control of MSM, metal ETF's, algo boxes and 100 other etc's

So just a fwiw addition.

But all the above are "possibly" just supressing perhaps the desired trend like a spring.



For full methodology, assumptions and caveats etc
- see

http://www.deviantinvestor.com/4603/4603/

gazkaz - 12 Jun 2013 22:44 - 22 of 1034

Hi & Welcome DoobyD - good to have you over 'ere too

gazkaz - 12 Jun 2013 22:47 - 23 of 1034

Squirrell - you are getting busy with the headers - excellent work
- so as well as seeing welcome names coming over
- looking more and more like home up there at the top too :o)

gazkaz - 12 Jun 2013 23:31 - 24 of 1034

Interesting - in my speak - just taxpayers potentially bailing out...the banksters (again)

Government buys up - the shite underwater mortgages - restructures and writes off some of the debt.....so the householer can afford the reduced restructured debt
(&....the banks get rid of shite loans off their balance sheets....and who picks up the tab for the gov't writing off some of the mortgage debt.....yes - joe public, the taxpayer)

From the FEDy

With more than 11 million homes still “underwater,” the mortgage debt overhang caused by the housing bubble
- remains an impediment to economic growth and a burden on communities across the country.

One possible solution to this problem
- is for state and municipal governments
- to use their eminent domain authority..... to purchase and restructure underwater mortgages.
This novel solution...... is proposed in a new report from the Federal Reserve Bank of New York.

Many analysts agree that .....principal reductions..... are the best way to assist underwater homeowners
(those who owe more on their mortgages than their houses are worth).

Such write-downs can be difficult to achieve, however,
- when..... the underlying mortgages are securitized and held by private-label securitization trusts. Specifically, such loans are subject to pooling and servicing agreements that require collective action by a large majority of security holders before a loan can be modified.
- As a result, ......carrying out write-downs is challenging and sometimes impossible.

In “Paying Paul and Robbing No One: An Eminent Domain Solution for Underwater Mortgage Debt,” author Robert Hockett argues that one possible way to sidestep this problem is

- by having governments buy
- and ..restructure ..underwater mortgages.
(By utilizing their eminent domain authority, state and municipal governments could bypass the coordination problems posed by the pooling and servicing agreements).

They could then... reduce the principal.... on underwater loans,
- lowering the amount.... owed by borrowers
and thereby reducing the risk of default.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-06-11/eminent-domain-back-table-following-feds-latest-bailout-proposal

(& the taxpayer - picks up the tab.... as a result of the "lowering the amount.... owed by borrowers" & the banksters offload yet more of their shite - once again
- but they phrase it much more... succinctly...than I)


gazkaz - 12 Jun 2013 23:50 - 25 of 1034

Regarding the run on JP Morgan's Gold vault.
- They saw 28.4% of their Gold get up and leave ....overnight.
Well, not exactly correct. Yes the withdrawal was 28.4% of the total but the withdrawal was entirely from their CUSTOMER side of the vault!
- The customer side dropped by 217,844 ounces...
- only leaving 136,380 ounces of Gold left.

This represents OVER 61% of JP Morgan's customer Gold
- leaving...... in one day!
By the way there was another 136 notices issued today which represents another 13,600 ounces or
- another 10% of the remaining which should leave.... tomorrow!
Is this a run on the bank (vault) or what?

But wait, if you thought it couldn't get any better...it does.
- If you look at the what has so far been issued this month it amounts to 4,946 contracts, this is .....494,600 ounces
- yet JP Morgan claims to have only..... 413,525 ounces ....in their dealer account.
- This means they have ....a negative 81,074 ounces of Gold ....for delivery?

I bring this up because so far this year I don't believe that they have added..... ANY Gold to their dealer account.

Harvey Organ went back and checked each and every day this year and sees ...none,
- zero,
- not one single ounce ....added to the dealer side.
What's up with this? Is this a default?

They also "owe" over 81,000 ounces that was to be delivered by..... May 31st - from the customer side due to a 1,000 contract issuance,
-yet today is June 12th...am I missing something here?

So - if you are a fan of connecting the dots
- does this look like people not only - want their Gold
- they want it..... now !

What if you were one of the owners of part of the remaining dregs of 136,000 ounces?
(Would you maybe want to get your hands on it now...while they say that it's there?)

gazkaz - 13 Jun 2013 00:01 - 26 of 1034

Looks like Gensler
(Head of CFTC & the 4/5 or is it 10yr investigation into.... silver manipulation)

- looks like getting - the push.....for being....to hard on...
- wall st.

If that's an example of being too hard
- makes you wonder - how soft the new (ex SachsOFgold) replacement will be on wall st
- when (Ex sachsOFgold) Gensler goes

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/06/11/amanda-renteria-cftc-chief_n_3419039.html

gazkaz - 13 Jun 2013 00:16 - 27 of 1034

Even the DUTCH
- are bailing out the Banksters - wring off their toxic shite
- and even - an earlier bailout
- and saddling - the taxpayers with - the tab

I would imagine - The next - will probably be "Cyprus bail in" style

The Wall Street Journal:

The government rescue was inevitable after SNS Reaal
- suffered a run on deposits and.....
- failed to raise capital on its own.

- “It is worrisome.- Nearly the entire Dutch banking system is now on..... a government lifeline,”
(said Arnoud Boot, a professor of corporate finance at the University of Amsterdam).

The Dutch state will inject €2.2 billion ($2.99 billion) into the company,
- write off €800 million from .....an earlier bailout
- and €700 million on the value of SNS Reaal's toxic property loans.
- It will also provide an additional €6.1 billion in loans and guarantees
to put the firm on a sound footing.

BUT
- The burden to taxpayers will be eased somewhat through a (piddly) €1 billion contribution from the other Dutch banks through a special levy.3
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