Thought I'd start a new thread as this is going to be a major talking point this year...have not made up my mind yet...(unlike bucksfizz)....but thinking of voting for an exit as Europe is not doing Britain any good at all it seems....

She's folded.

From Nigel on the wireless:

2 years extra in the €U, not a transition, any laws/bugeting/other will have to comply with no say.

ECJ will be ultimate arbiter for 8 years, again no say.

Conceded vast amounts of money (no detail)

NI - foggy

No trade deals until 2021 at least

Hilary,

You shouldn't post selfies of yourself so early in the morning.

8-)

That doesn't sound like a negotiation to me , more a surrender , when the going got tough spineless comes to mind .

Man the barricades, chaps. Tally Ho. Chocks away.

It is a breakthrough!

I've sent May an Orange .

Fred's happy, so you know it's a bum deal.

And the border with Northern Ireland will be in the sea and as to where it is will depend upon whether the tide is in or out and from which side of the border you are looking at it. It will not be very wide either. Thickness may be a problem but that can always be ironed out.

Importantly though, it won't be a hard border to find and so both sides and also the Irish side too and the rest of the island of Ireland, will all be happy, to be sure, to be sure.

Mark.

"Tusk said Britain will have to respect all EU laws during the transition, as well as respect its budgetary commitments and the bloc’s judicial oversight. But it would no longer take part in decision-making that will be done by the 27 remaining states".

As stated previously!

At the end of discussions, little in practice will be changed except that the Uk will not
be at the table drawing up the rules and regulations or discussing the menu but still having to stick to the diet and paying part of the bill.

Daft.

Fred.

The UK had little influence anyway, the big burghers are the driving force as you well know.


But just in case you were in any doubt, read this:


'United States of Europe by 2025': German SPD leader names his price for joining Merkel coalition



Martin Schulz gestures after delivering a speech during a party congress of Germany's Social Democrats in Berlin, on December 7 Credit: TOBIAS SCHWARZ/ AFP



By Justin Huggler, Berlin and
James Crisp, Brussels
7 December 2017 • 7:27pm




The man who could be Germany’s vice-chancellor within weeks on Thursday called for the European Union to transform itself into a “United States of Europe”.

Martin Schulz, the leader of the German Social Democratic Party (SPD), called for a new federal constitution for the EU by 2025.

Hours before his party voted to open talks on forming a new coalition with the beleaguered Angela Merkel, Mr Schulz made clear he would demand radical EU reform and far deeper integration than previously envisaged as his price for ending weeks of political crisis in Germany.



More:http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/12/07/german-spd-leader-martinschulz-seeks-united-states-europe-2025/

United States of Germany i think they mean .

See what can happen when these fanatical types get in , changes just like that .

Other countries will reach critical mass.

Mark,

I think Schulz is talking sense.

Good to see harmonious relationships in a family or business.

Easier to prosper and stop bickering.

Getting on with my neighbours makes it easier for me to sleep at night.


But what do we have to live with after all the blustering?

Add to that ill-feelings to-wards the UK.

-=-=--=-=

"Draft guidelines showed the transition period would last around two years. During that time, Britain will remain part of the customs union and single market but will no longer take part in EU institutions or have a vote. It will still be subject to EU law."

Now there's a word made for you Freda " Blustering " suits you sir , you and your sort must be the answer to these peoples prayers , just lay down and let them walk all over you , then it's too late . Harmonious relationship my arse it's come with us or else , you dimwit .

Just to cheer up Manuel and Max.

Manuel.

Something for you to get your false teeth into.

As corporate goliaths grow ever larger, Britain looks increasingly exposed
Will Hutton

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/dec/10/corporate-goliaths-grow-ever-larger-britain-increasingly-exposed

Here is another interesting commentary on the Brexit debacle.


The more they say they are all happy the more sceptical you should be
Andrew Rawnsley


https://www.theguardian.com/uk/commentisfree


Half the cabinet should be lynched!


There's moderation for you.