Thought I'd start a new thread as this is going to be a major talking point this year...have not made up my mind yet...(unlike bucksfizz)....but thinking of voting for an exit as Europe is not doing Britain any good at all it seems....

the election result in hungary is quite disturbing, as the overwhelming winner for the 3rd time is viktor orban from the pretty (ugly) far right with the distant 2nd-placed party being descendants of the genghis khan democratic party



orban erected a monument in 2014 which says much about his party's political views, as outlined below

Critics of the monument – which depicts Hungary as the Archangel Gabriel being attacked by a German imperial eagle – say it absolves the Hungarian state and Hungarians of their active role in sending some 450,000 Jews to their deaths during the occupation.

And another remoaner myth bites the dust...


https://uk.finance.yahoo.com/news/goldman-sachs-ceo-says-hes-proved-wrong-brexit-far-170345140.html

So that's another we can add to a long and growing list headed by scaremongers Cammy and Osbourne.

Labour guy on QT last night still spouting the same old shite about us not voting to leave the customs union / single market blah blah blah. Maybe he should have read the literature the government sent to every household , made it clear what would happen if we voted out.

350 days to go.

i believe he got shot down by some woman on the panel

Audience weren't amused either when he mentioned a second referendum.

Letters: United action against chemical attacks is undermined by Germany


14 April 2018 • 12:01am





SIR – No wonder Germany declares it will take no military action over the chemical attack in Syria. The Gazprom scandal (report, April 13) lays bare the hypocrisy of the EU and Germany.

On the one hand Britain is told we can’t have a bespoke trade deal, as the same rules apply to all 27 nations. On the other, Germany “negotiates” a deal with Russia’s state-backed Gazprom to receive gas more cheaply than other EU nations. This goes against EU regulations, but, since it is Germany, a blind eye is turned, while poorer neighbours suffer far higher rates.

To add insult to injury, Germany then pushes Gazprom’s agenda with Brussels to undermine EU regulations further, yet no action is taken.



More if you sign up:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/2018/04/14/lettersunited-action-against-chemical-attacks-undermined-germany/

Moral cowardice...

Wtf do they contribute to NATO too ?

Can understand their position re front line action but are they paying their way and what about Merkel making a statement backing her two biggest EU defence allies ?

EU silence says it all ... 27 countries united with a common goal my arse.

We still negotiating a deal with the EU or have we told them to get in line with rest of the world ?

Gone a bit quiet lately , I'm beginning to miss Barny and Junkit's rantings and threats.

https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-eu-france-macron-brexit/best-way-for-uk-to-keep-eu-trade-links-is-eu-membership-macron-idUKKBN1HO1KN?feedType=nl&feedName=uktopnewsearly&utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=2018%20Template:%20LUNCH%20BREAK%20NEWS%202018-04-17&utm_term=UK%20Lunch%20Break


An interesting read.

I doubt it Fred unless of course you still don't believe we're leaving.

Peers versus the people as they vote down coming out of the customs union (ie. leaving the EU).

I think the people will win! The EU is not a democracy and is utterly barmy.

And so does my hero and 'PM in waiting', Jacob Rees-Mogg. He says a lot of the red robed EU supporters are 'cave dwellers' who rely on the support of the EU for their pensions.

Looks like the Father Christmas of the Year awards except that Father Christmas serves a purpose.

I nicked this from across the road, no link.



Mount Teide
22 Apr '18 - 17:04 - 66756 of 66769
0   3  1



Globally, the scale and pace of the economic decline of the EU since the UK joined is staggering.

In 1980, the nine nations then in the EU accounted for 30% of global GDP – measured by purchasing power parity, adjusting for prices.

Today, although the EU now has three times more member states, its world GDP share has plunged to 16pc.

The Commonwealth has fared differently. In 1980, its members made up 15pc of global GDP. Today, the figure is 18% with no increase in member states.

Clearly, abandoning a Commonwealth that subsequently went on to grow at many, many multiples of the rate of a massively over-regulated, highly protectionist EU has been a monumental mistake of epic proportions.

And, staying in or in very close alignment to the EU will only compound that huge mistake.

Why? Because demography is destiny. The EU has shrunk dramatically in relative economic terms, while its population profile continues to get much older. The Commonwealth, in contrast, home to a third of the world’s population and two fifths of those under 40, is primed for massive future growth. The Commonwealth is “the future”.

The Commonwealth boasts the second-biggest economy in Asia and the largest in Africa – the two most populous continents. Vibrant and fast growing, these continents are still building infrastructure and adopting new technologies at breakneck speed. They are at the heart of the West-to-East shift in global commerce, the economic mega trend of our time.

Those who dismissively scoff that Commonwealth nations are geographically distant ignore how global trade has changed. Almost total and continuous connectivity has slashed the cost of commu­nications and information transfer inside global value chains.

That has completely upended world trade patterns, making old trade-bloc thinking increasingly irrelevant. There is now far more freight containers shipped on Intra Asian and African Routes than on the once mighty trade shipping lanes to the USA and Europe combined.


Data Source - Liam Halligan/Economist

Aye , stuff the single market we voted to leave not remain.

.

if you removed the 19 "new" members from the equation, many of whom must be more of a drag than a benefit, then what would be the result?

My political hero tells it so fundamentally clearly.
From the Belfast Telegraph;

Peers playing with fire in attempts to thwart Brexit – Jacob Rees-Mogg
The influential Tory backbencher hinted that the future of the House of Lords could be in doubt if peers continued to oppose the people.
April 24 2018

The future of the House of Lords could be in doubt as peers are “playing with fire” by trying to thwart Brexit, Jacob Rees-Mogg has warned.

The Tory MP, leader of the influential European Research Group of Conservatives, said it was now a case of the “peers against the people” after the Government’s Brexit legislation suffered a series of defeats in the upper chamber.

His comments came after a petition calling for a referendum on abolishing the House of Lords passed the 100,000 signature mark, which could trigger a debate in Parliament.

"I think their lordships are playing with fire and it would be a shame to burn down a historic house" - Jacob Rees-Mogg

Mr Rees-Mogg, speaking in Parliament at an event organised by the Open Europe think tank, said peers “have to decide whether they love ermine or the EU more”.

In a series of forthright interventions, Mr Rees-Mogg:

– Said giving preferential immigration treatment to EU citizens after Brexit would be a “racist” policy

– Described Theresa May’s approach to Brexit as “enigmatic”

– Labelled the Government’s proposal for a customs partnership with the EU “completely cretinous”

The Government’s plans for Brexit have been dealt a series of blows in the Lords, with peers inflicting a massive defeat on the issue of leaving the customs union.

Mr Rees-Mogg claimed that peers were breaching the convention that the House of Lords should not prevent a Government implementing commitments made in its election manifesto.

And he said the Prime Minister had made it “absolutely clear” that she would not accept remaining in a customs union after Brexit.

The Government is expected to try to overturn the amendment in the Commons and Mr Rees-Mogg warned would-be Tory rebels: “I don’t think it’s fine for people to tell their voters they are standing to leave the customs union and then not to do that.”

In a message to the peers he accused of seeking to “thwart” the referendum result, Mr Rees-Mogg said: “It’s striking that 100,000 people can sign a petition so quickly.

“I think their lordships are playing with fire and it would be a shame to burn down a historic house.”

A petition calling for a referendum on the future of the Lords has passed 100,000 signatures.

Mr Rees-Mogg played down the prospect of the Government collapsing over the customs union issue, insisting that when it came to a vote in the Commons it would not be a confidence motion.

He rejected the suggestion that a defeat would be so damaging for Mrs May’s authority she would have to stand down.

“I think when you have got a very small majority you accept that you won’t always get every vote that you want, and you have to look at the legal effect of what happens.”

Theresa May's attitude to Brexit is hard to read

He said the Prime Minister’s attitude to Brexit was “hard to read”, but it was a “good thing” to have a leader who exercised self-control.

“The Prime Minister is a very enigmatic figure in this respect. She is carrying out the will of the British people but it’s hard to read what level of enthusiasm she has for it.

“She is doing it, she has never indicated anything other than that, she said ‘Brexit means Brexit’, but she doesn’t – by her nature – express herself unduly emotionally.

“I think that’s rather a good thing. I like having a Prime Minister who is able to exercise a good deal of self-control.”

The North East Somerset MP said if he was in the negotiations with Brussels he would be “much firmer and clearer about the costs to the EU” of a “no deal” scenario – which could leave the bloc “insolvent” without the UK’s money and risk crippling the Irish economy.

And he mocked the idea of a customs partnership, one of the two options put forward by the UK to deal with future customs arrangements.

The “completely cretinous” idea would see the UK collect tariffs on the EU’s behalf for goods landing in Britain but intended for the bloc’s market, something Mr Rees-Mogg said would be “impractical, bureaucratic” and “a betrayal of common sense”.

Mr Rees-Mogg, who has been tipped as a potential successor to Mrs May, played down his prospects.

“When the Conservative Party is in government, the prime minister always comes from a senior government position and that is a perfectly sensible state of affairs,” he said.

What a Mangy Moggy he is.




What group of "the people" does he represent and which part of the public is he happy to abuse for his own advantages?

Well said Mr Mogg.

Anything that pisses Fred off is fine by me.

A referendum on the future of the House of Lords , that would show them the meaning of democracy.