for more information about stanelco click on the links.

driver's research page link
http://www.moneyam.com/InvestorsRoom/posts.php?tid=7681#lastread
website link
http://www.stanelco.co.uk/index.htm

Shamoaner

'I'm stopping posting here for a while, from now on i'll only respond to blatant untruths.'

You just can't stop yourself can you?

Didn't think it would take long

pm1, re 9556, i agree with you entirely but, this has already been said by many posters months ago. there really is no need to labour the point.
baza, tuesday tomorrow, how's the water?

Bos - as I said last week - I think we will get an RNS either tomorrow or Friday - me water thinks it will be Friday - but what do I know

Baza

shamona - 18 Sep 2005 22:26 - 9535 of 9560
Are you lot on drugs?

This is valued at circa 175 million pounds and is years away from ever realising a profit, fair value is in the 2p region yet you lot think this will see a quid this year!

I'll lay my reputation on the line that this will be sub 10p by xmas before quickly plummeting all next year before settling in the 2 to 4p zone.

Some of you need to start learning how markets work and fast!

shamona,

I for one would love to know how you derived at your 2 - 4p projection for SEO? You state you will
lay your reputation on the line if the share price is not sub 10p by xmas. I assume you mean 2005.

Your argument lack detailed prognosis, which is understandable I suppose give the work gone in to your guestimates.

Howard White told conveyed to us yesterday.

Lemming Investor have had details discussions with the company on several occasions, most recently yesterday. I would like to assure you that Howard White is more optimistic that any shareholder I have spoken too.

Howard had the following to say to us Yesterday after we voiced concerns regarding clarity from ASDA roll in the loss of one of their suppliers.

lemming Investor considers the share price to be at high risk as long as there is no explanation of the role of Norhern Foods and their immediate stance re Greenseal, and or whether and/or how Ferndale Foods lost their footing and their contract. Clarification of these points would remove one of the the issues holding back the price.

Northern Foods is not on our current list, we are working with several ASDA suppliers and will announce the milestones as and when.

As to Ferndale, we announced that we did trials with them. They are no longer major long term suppliers to ASDA it would appear, and one might draw conclusions as to why that particular GREENSEAL project did not proceed.

The market has not yet understood the prize that is Biotec. It will start to clarify shortly.

End of quote: But there is more:-)

We will be one of the first to report what others have missed.

editor@lemminginvestor.com

Oily Hi,

The e-mails I sent this weekend weren't for capsules, they were for three new uses for Biotec TPS, and I posted the market size for each product.

The e-mail replies were not auto-replies, someone took the time to acknowledge each of two of the ideas, they showed interest, and they said they would be looking into the ideas.

The companies in question already use petrol based plastic for their products, and I have suggested using Biotec TPS to create biodegradable versions of their products, and emphasized that Biotec TPS can compete with the petrol based plastics they are currently using.

One company recently had a good slagging off in the papers for reaching a massive milestone in production, all of which has ended up in a landfill or incinerator somewhere, and a few websites have been set up with e-mail address links to the company, for everyone to comlplain about their lack of environmental responsibility, I sent my idea to the company at those e-mail addresses, rather than complaining, I was giving them the solution :)

Cheers,
PM

PM1,

Would this be disposable nappies by any chance?

That's what immediately sprang to mind.

Yep. That's what I thought as well..

elrico,

Thanks for your post.

You state that Howard has told Lemminginvestor that ' Northern Foods is not on our current list'.

If that means what I think it means, then I'm absolutely astonished. If ASDA were serious about Greenseal then surely they would have required the winner of the 30m contract to commit to using Greenseal? What an opportunity lost.

Two large sells today - no wonder.

Sorry for sounding a tad depressed, but if this is true, this is not sort of news I expected, or wanted.

What are other peoples thoughts?

erm......

lets hope for a positive rn v soon!

It doesn't matter if SEO get Northern Foods or not the contract is 30m to Northern Foods SEO'S cut is small fry. Asda are committed to 200 + retro fits who ever gets them shouldn't matter to us; if they cannot deliver we should pull out and go elsewhere.

PM1

in the light of your reply above, I and perhaps others on this board, would appreciate you copying and pasting with inverted commas the actual text of the replies you received from the companies responding to your message re converting to Biotec TPS.

The oily one

Oily Hi,

For one thing, I would have to cut out certain words that would give away the idea, due to commercial sensitivity(someone might steal the ideas !), also the e-mails are from them to me, so should I or shouldn't I post their 'in confidence' replies ????

Also these ideas have only just hit Stanelco HQ, they are IMHO great ideas, but have to be designed, manufactured and tested.

One day I am sure I will be able to fulfil your request, but not yet ....

I am sure that if any of the ideas are commercialised, that you will be able to ask Stanelco or the companies in question, 'who suggested the idea', and the answer will be PM1.

And in answer to another question, it's not nappies, the three items have not appeared as ideas for Stanelco/Biotec/Aquasol/etc products on any BB I have read.

Cheers,
PM

Hi All,

I feel we have a big seller again, and that is causing the other MM's to push the price down, to squeeze them out. I hope they are gone soon, maybe the big sells at the end today was them, and hopefully their last chunk.

Not worried, bough a few more today as one of my other stocks had hit it's peak, so I sold them and got more Stanelco while they are cheap, as it won't last much longer :)

Cheers,
PM

Dormar,

I voice your concerns but as someone else stated (or it maybe you) the Northern Foods was worth 30m, but as for SEO's cut, it would only be a small proportion. At the end of the day, ASDA are committed to several hundred conversions at 5m plus. I'm not sure on the details, but my guess is that ASDA will have to pay up regardless.

It's interesting that Howard is more optimistic than any shareholder (including PM1??). The interesting point is:

"The market has not yet understood the prize that is Biotec. It will start to clarify shortly"

Now from this statement, we all thought Greenseal will turn SEO around, but it appears that the Biotec acquisition is much bigger than we all could possibly imagine. Effectively it could be the golden egg and I suspect we could see some RNS's to do with Starpol etc.

For all we know, there might have been a further 10 conversions on Greenseal. As stated before, not everyone is going to be announced via an RNS, otherwise we will be getting one every week for any machines converted (if it happens).

IMHO

Kong

elrico

Your post left more questions than answers, i'm afraid you'll have to do a lot better before I ever contemplate subscribing for your amateur site; at 168 million pounds market cap this is clearly overvalued, if you can't see that then I fear for your readers. The 2p target is based on the shell value as I don't believe Stanelco have a viable business model, it appears no one wants Greenseal, it now also looks like they they were forced into the panic buying of loss making Biotec; if Biotec was so good why were the former owners so keen to offload?????????

New year, new product syndrome i'm afraid, furnaces were loss making, Ingel was thought up via an allegedly stolen idea, now tray lidding is being forgotten about by the looks of it; Northern foods have won a huge contract without rf sealing which may suggest it's not deemed to be a required part of any one companies portfolio as far as a contract goes. Cheapest rules it seems!

Grenseal now seems to have been forgotten in favour of petalpack, fropack, biodegradeable corks and now Biotec; what exactly is the core business?

The writing was on the wall for me when I saw the footage of the helicopter frogpack trials, what an utter waste of money for a loss making company.

ps Ask Scrutable how confident Graham Hind was in his interview with him, he was positively blooming while all the time the company was crumbling behind him; take a tip from him!



ALL>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Surprise surprise, masterson can't/won't post the replies!

As predicted they don't exist, lol.

One also notes he mentioned they weren't auto replies as I suggested, strange why he always trips himself up when he claims never to read my posts. Small tip for the inexperienced here, pop over to advfn and read bes_extreme's posts from a year ago on the bes thread; paul used to post under that name. You'll see the same type of posts there i.e the company tell me big things are around the corner, i've mailed the head of a huge drinks company who tells me his company is really interested etc etc....

paulmasterson1 - 19 Sep 2005 19:35 - 9570 of 9572

Oily Hi,

For one thing, I would have to cut out certain words that would give away the idea, due to commercial sensitivity(someone might steal the ideas !), also the e-mails are from them to me, so should I or shouldn't I post their 'in confidence' replies ????


LOL

Companies giving sensitive information to 'the privileged one'?

This thread gives great entertainment. Is there such a phrase as 'to be googlerised'? As in death by google?

No offence to regulars who I come across on other boards.

Zscrooge Hi,

LOL !!!! .... is all I can say to that .... who do you think is giving whom the sensitive information .... it's MY IDEA !

Cheers,
PM

Hi All,

I notice people are waking up to Biotec now, so I give you some info to digest, and then you might see the part of the big picture for Biotec, and its collection of IP ....

Right-click and save the PDF, then open it, it's better than in a browser :)
Bioplastics PDF

EXECUTIVE SUMMARY
The market for plastics in the United States and Europe is about 73 million tons and is growing
at an annual rate of 3 5%. The major end uses are packaging (about 25% in the US and 36% in
Europe) and construction (about 22% in the US and 20% in Europe). Other important markets
include transportation, furniture and furnishings, electrical and electronics, adhesives, inks and
coatings.

There are two basic types of plastics. Thermoplastics like polyethylene (PE), polypropylene
(PP), and polyvinyl chloride (PVC) make up the greatest share of plastics used in packaging.
They can be softened by heat and shaped by extrusion, moulding, or pressing into any form
required. They are also recyclable. Thermosets are plastics that can be softened when heated, but
cannot be converted back to their original form. Thermosets are valued for their durability and
strength and are used primarily in automotive and construction applications, although they can
also be used in adhesives, inks and coatings. Examples of thermosets include polyurethanes,
unsaturated polyesters, and epoxies.

Plastics can also be divided into commodity polymers (e.g., PE, PP, PVC), which sell for under
CAN$2.82 per kilogram; mid-range and transitional polymers (e.g., PET, Nylon), which sell for
CAN$2.82 to $5.64 per kilogram; performance engineering polymers, which sell for US$5.64 to
$28.22 per kilogram; and high performance plastics at greater than US$28.22 per kilogram.
Canadas plastics industry focuses mainly on commodity plastics. Engineered plastics are
typically imported from the US. At present, the performance limitations of most bioplastics
restrict their applications to commodity plastics. However, new technological developments are
allowing bioplastics (e.g., PLA) and bioplastic/synthetic blends (e.g., PEIT, PTT, or 3GT) to
penetrate the mid-range and transitional polymer category.

Biodegradable plastics are gaining market momentum in Europe as a result of government
regulations promoting the composting of biodegradable materials. The EU market for bioplastics
in 2000 was 23,000 tonnes and is expected to grow to 454,000 to 907,000 tonnes by 2010, and 3
5 million tonnes by 2020. Polymers made from renewable resources derived from starch and
sugar are expected to account for 60% of the market for EU biodegradables in 2010, in part
because of their greater cost advantage over biodegradable synthetic polymers made from
petrochemicals. Films (50%), foams (20%), and a variety of others, e.g., fibres and functional
additives (30%) will account for most of the product types. Market segments will include
packaging, textiles/nonwovens, horticulture/agriculture, and as well as non-biodegradable
products. By 2020, the share of polymers from renewable sources is expected to increase to 70
80% of the EU biodegradable market.

At present, starch-based bioplastics (either unmodified or modified and complexed with other
polymers) account for most of the production capacity in Europe. The major centres of
production are Novamont (Italy) and National Starch Company (UK), which have a capacity of
32,000 tonnes, and Rodenburg BioPolymers (Netherlands), which has recently constructed a
36,000-tonne facility that converts waste potato starch into bioplastics. Packaging materials
(food, loosefill, shopping bags, fruit and vegetable wrap, catering service ware, composting bags,
and agricultural film) have penetrated most Western European markets including England,
France, Germany, Italy, Scandinavia, Switzerland, and Austria.

The US markets are also expanding, but they are being driven more by traditional economic
drivers such as price and performance. Production capacity in the US is dominated by Cargill
Dow LLC, which has built a 140,000 tonne per year polylactic acid (PLA) plant in Blair,
Nebraska. PLA is being used to make food packaging (e.g., bio-oriented films, thermoformed
trays and lids), fibre applications (apparel, industrial fibres, nonwovens) and fibrefill
(comforters, pillows). Cargill Dow has identified market opportunities for 4.3 billion kilograms
of PLA, valued at over $12.8 billion.

At present, other renewable sources of bioplastics like polyhydroxy alkanoates (PHAs/PHBs),
proteins, and cellulose derivatives represent only a minor fraction of the market, although this
could change dramatically as a result of new research and development. For example, Proctor &
Gamble has made great progress and hopes to commercially produce PHBs by 2004.
Current market projections for bioplastics in Europe and the US do not appear to threaten food
markets. The 3 5 million tonnes of bioplastics predicted for the EU by 2020 would require an
estimated 2.5+ million acres. The total identified market opportunities for PLA worldwide would
require about 6% of the US corn production, well under annual ending stocks (back-up supply)
of 10.3%.

Bioplastics production is also expected to reduce greenhouse gas (GHG) emissions. As a rule of
thumb, starch-based plastics can save between 0.8 and 3.2 tonnes of CO2 per tonne compared to
one tonne of fossil fuel-derived plastic. The range reflects the share of petroleum-based
copolymers used in the plastic. The lifecycle GHG savings (in CO2 equivalents) for oilseedbased
plastic alternatives has been estimated to be 1.5 tons per ton of polyol made from rapeseed
oil.

The International Biodegradable Polymers Association & Working Group estimates that CO2
savings potential would be 9 27 million tonnes if the EU market for biodegradable plastics was
to reach 3 5 million tonnes by 2020, assuming renewable raw materials were to comprise a 70
80% share of that market, and 50% was compostable.
Cargill Dow LLC has compared the life cycle CO2 emissions from various plastics and found a
very favourable profile for PLA, significantly better than cellulose, nylon-6,6, PET, polystyrene,
and polypropylene.

Based on the data currently available, it appears that bioplastic production is a sustainable activity.

A wide range of natural biopolymers can be used to make plastics. In general, these biopolymers
come from livestock, crops, forests, marine life (e.g., shell fish and algae), insects, bacteria, and
fungi. These biopolymers can be used for a vast range of applications, including but not limited
to, adhesives, coatings, high performance fibres, plastics, cosmetics, pharmaceuticals, and
medical and surgical devices. This study focuses on industrial-scale applications using
biopolymers derived from agricultural feedstocks. Bioplastics represents one of the largest
potential application areas.

The current market (2002) for starch-based bioplastics accounts for about 23,000 tonnes per
year, although production capacity has now increased to about 68,000 tonnes per year. This
increased capacity will allow further market expansion. Until the Cargill Dow PLA plant was
built, starch-based plastics accounted for about 75 80% of the global market for bioplastics.
About 75% of the starch-based plastic resins are used for packaging applications. The main
advantage of starch-based plastics is their lower cost compared to other synthetic biodegradbale
plastics. Their weakness is their water sensitivity, although this issue can be addressed in
numerous ways, e.g., by blending starch with biodegradable synthetic polymers. The price of
starch-based bioplastics in Europe ranges from $2.04 to $6.52 per kilogram.

A number of companies are now producing starch-based plastics including: Biotec GmbH
(Germany), VTT Chemical Technology (Finland), EverCorn, Inc. (US), Novamont (Italy),
EarthShell (US), AVEBE (US), Rodenburg BioPolymers (Netherlands), StarchTech, Inc. (US),
and Vegeplast (France). Perhaps the main player in Europe at the moment is Novamont (Italy),
which owns 80 patents and related extensions.

LOL !!

Packaging companies worldwide are waiting here with baited breath for paul to let his idea slip, I can almost feel the tension!

ps You need help son.