Had this on the watch list too long and could kick my own ass if it was possible. I think this is just the type of play needed on these markets along with Value shares such as Churchill China that I recommended yesterday.

Heres just a brief background on the company.................

Hedge fund leads rush to float
by Louise Armitstead
RAB Capital is the first to plan a listing in London. Others are bound to follow

IN the spring of 1999 Philip Richards and Michael Alen-Buckley arrived almost empty-handed at their new office — a small room in 1 Adam Street, just off the Strand in central London.
The day — April Fools’ Day — seemed apt at the time. Richards and Alen-Buckley, both highly regarded bankers at Merrill Lynch, were giving up stellar careers to start their own hedge fund, RAB Capital. The only money they had was their own, and their staff consisted of one manager, a compliance officer and a secretary.

Five years on, the little room in 1 Adam Street, still RAB Capital’s main trading floor, albeit straining under a vastly expanded workforce, is again the engine room of an ambitious and pioneering venture.

Last week RAB Capital became the first stand-alone hedge-fund company to announce its intention to float in London.

Richards, 46, and Alen-Buckley, 43, will be at the helm of a company with a market value that could be as high as 100m. Their stakes could be worth 30m each. Advised by KBC Peel Hunt, the firm will release a prospectus tomorrow revealing how much money it intends to raise.

In the past five years, Richards, a former army officer, and Alen-Buckley, who is the son-in-law of the hotelier Lord Forte, have increased their funds under management from 4m to an estimated 1.1 billion. They have 40 staff (16 of them managers), 7 hedge funds and a track record that is the envy of the City.

RAB’s first fund, the European equities fund, which was launched in November 1999, has made returns of 84% despite the tumbling markets.

Floating will for the first time allow small investors to take part in the success of a hedge-fund boutique rather than investing in one fund.

But there is growing concern that they will also be exposed to risks that at the moment are restricted to professional investors.

Watching in the wings are hundreds of other hedge-fund managers, salivating at the thought of following RAB to market and realising the value of their businesses. Investment bankers and advisers are also rubbing their hands at the prospect of a spate of similar deals.

Two funds earmarked for flotation are Thames River Capital and GLG Partners, one of the biggest hedge funds in London, with about $8 billion under management. Experts say plenty of others are looking to float as a way of cashing in.

Richards and Alen-Buckley dismiss the suggestion that this is their motive for floating RAB. “Right from the start we wanted to create a long-term business and we’re here to stay,” said Richards. “Floating is an indication of our permanence. Neither one of us will be taking cash out. We are also doing this for our staff. We have given them options over the years and this will be their chance to realise some cash. Staff loyalty is important to us and to our clients, who like the stability this offers.”

The cash raised from the float will also be used to launch additional hedge funds and bankroll the company’s rapid expansion.

Managers have already been hired for several new funds that will specialise in energy and in Japan. Small investors are likely to be attracted through a joint venture with Saga, which provides services for the over-fifties and has 7m customers.

Richards and Alen-Buckley built impressive reputations in the City working together in the late 1980s at Smith New Court, where they helped to build the stockbroker from a market value of 10m to one of 500m by the time it was sold to Merrill Lynch in 1995.

Both men had been watching the growing hedge-fund industry with interest. Alen-Buckley had numerous contacts, including leading figures such as George Soros. They spent four years at Merrill before quitting to set up RAB.

Alen-Buckley, who is taking the title of executive chairman, is described as the “public face” of the business. Richards, who goes from chief investment officer to chief executive, is more involved in strategy.

Richards runs the Special Situations fund, which is just over a year old but has already generated a return of 1,274%.

Since hedge funds are known for being opaque and secretive, observers are concerned that RAB will struggle to live with the scrutiny that comes with being a public company.

Richards said the company planned to float on the Alternative Investment Market (AIM) rather than the main market so that lengthy meetings with institutions could be avoided. “We want to spend our time managing the money, not talking about it,” he said.

“We have a simple philosophy. Our goal is to produce consistent returns in all market conditions. We think that if you work on managing the risks and reducing the downside, the upside tends to look after itself. The float is exciting but it will still be business as usual.”ENDS



Please DYOR, you are responsible for your own buying and selling timing actions.

cheers GF

The moderators have said to concentrate on the share, not the poster, you are doing yourself no favours in your bull debate.

One of my points is this is very valid one:

"the FSA says it was concerned about the risk posed to the financial system by hedge funds. It singles out growing competition as a potential area of concern."

I can understand why you wish that you could get me to leave so I can't air such points.


Furthermore I think I am entitled to my opinion this has been a hyped up share to say the least also my opinion that gold has peaked & that I think mining shares have generally had their peak....it seems the market doesn't regard the future re:RAB as it once did, not too long ago.


As I say I erxpect 30p next & each call so far has been correct, perhaps that's what you don't like reading.


Some interesting earlier posts about competition too....I won't repeat them all here for your sake.


PS I'm not leaving, I am entiltled to my view as you are yours....on RAB would be welcome rather than the poster please.

YES in that case provide your so recent facts and figures that RAB is not a good investment. Please state why one should really sell their shares.

The FSA is always concerns about many things, like irregularities in share dealing and corporate managements, but what u just posted has not foundations or any bearings on how the share price is gonna behave. for your information the FTSE Other Finances benchmark (RAB is in it) is not doing very well against FTSE all share and FTSE 100. It is like say sell all Vodaphone because their shares are going down.... that not the way one should invest. fundamentals and sectors (i would say sectors in vogue play an 80% of the price in any share) Take a look at the dog of BGY it is riddle with debt and almost going down the drain BUT its share price is doing fine because electricyty/utilities sector is going up. You probably loosing money in RAB cos you bought at the top and want everyone to suffer.

It's no use assuming I bought or if I'm short or if I don't hold, that adds nothing to the value of the debate.


My reasons are posted, I'm not repeating it all, just take look back through the thread....lets turn the tables, I have yet to see a convincing post as to why the shares should be bought at this much lower price, a reason in iteslf perhaps that the shares will continue to drift in my opinion.


I can't see any justification at why these are trading at a premium to the 25p float price of circa 40%, maybe others think the same which is why it has continued to be unsupported at these much cheaper prices.


Perhaps less whineging of my reasons for posting or speculating on what my position is, might give your bull case a boost?

They were lauched at 38p not 25p. So whoever bought around fine, if not then hold. The bullish reasons were stated at the beginning of the thread (i assumed you read them too) This will outperform it benchmark in the long run when things turn around for the better for 'other finance' sector.

especially for you No-Eyes.

Platinum Capital sees hedge fund boom
Tue 1 June, 2004 13:57

LONDON (Reuters) - Investment group Platinum Capital Management says estimates of money flowing into hedge funds are conservative and the industry should see massive growth over the next six years.

Platinum forecasts hedge fund assets under management will grow to around $4 trillion by 2010, double an earlier forecast of $2 trillion by U.S. investment bank Putnam Lovell.

"The hedge fund industry today is in the same position that mutual funds were in 1980," said Craig Reeves managing director at Platinum. "It's not understood, not regulated and growing at a ferocious pace."

The mutual fund industry in the United States in 1980 was made up of small boutiques. But in the 18 years to 1998 assets under management have risen to around $3 trillion from $15 billion.

Estimates of money currently invested in hedge funds range between $800 billion and $1.1 trillion.

Most of the money managed by hedge funds now comes from private clients.

Platinum expects that to change as institutional investors from many countries -- including Asia -- start to look at hedge funds as a means of improving returns.

Platinum is a fund of hedge funds with around $300 million under management compared to $150 million a year ago. About 40 percent of the $150 million rise is due to investment gains, the rest is new money.

Platinum is regulated by Britain's Financial Services Authority, but the funds it invests in are all offshore.

Industry experts estimate that between 60-80 percent of around 8,000 hedge funds are registered with the Cayman Island Monetary Authority in the Caribbean.

Which makes the FSA investigation & warning I posted earlier in the thread even more relevant.

And they gonna do??? Halt the existence of hedge funds? whilst I c your point, the benefits are far more established. There is always a risk, in any kind of investment, we dont know what is gonna happen in the future, but we who invest in RAB see a positive outcome. Anyway, not gonna carry on with this. Good look and happy returns to all RAB holders.

They wont halt anything but they may well restrict...which may cap expansion, amongst other guidlines or rules to adhere too.

I do not agree with everthing ThirdEye posts but the fact remains that RAB has fallen from 64p to 35p in a short period. 45% down in six weeks is not entirely due to external events or low investor confidence. Can goldfinger or other posters enlighten me. Thanks.

ramu, goldfinger has said they are going to 1 quick time, (see for yourself earlier in the thread) I'll repeat it for you if it makes you feel better, but these have been over hyped in my opinion a lot of clever selective posts re: performance, and realism has set in, you don't have to agree with me, the price is talking for me.

Despite what xmortal says these were issued at 25p & are still circa 40% above that & indeed that was inflated after the mining sector boom.

Wait and see, we'll get there, how long? I dont know, the share have been oversold, like all other shares. There will be a bounce back and consolidation, mining sectors is picking up slowly.

Thirdeye has a grudge with Goldfinger, i think his lost alot of money in the past and is holding goldfinger responsible...
therefore he continues to deramp all of goldfingers shares....

i doubt it will work....

but hey if you have nothing else to pass your time with...then what can i say....

Very interesting post from Janus 541 on the AFE thread which points us to an article about the Berlin stock exchange and tells us what is really going on !!
it is no help to those nursing losses but does give hope if you hang in there and maybe we blame the MMs unfairly. >>> Has anyone followed the link yet---it adds to the debate!!

Absolute rubbish Invisage, I post what I think is overvalued & I have been right on the two I have posted on reguarly.....JCR which we were told is on a p/e of 1 and was going to make 1.5 million in the thread, it made circa one tenth & has a very worrying gearing position, which was not mentioned.

The other I have posted on more than a few times is RAB, we were told it's going to 1 quick time, it's gone from 60p to 34p.


Good to have some balance isn't it? .....I know of a few posters who much appreciated my posts on JCR & said it saved them getting burnt.


If your statement were true, I'd be posting reguarly on about 30 threads not two.


Also unlike you I don't resort to calling posters a t*** or c*** as you did me earlier in this thread.....the bulls don't act very dignified manner on here do they? Why not tell us why we should be buying at this "cheap" level instead of attacking the poster?

Good spot Invisage. SCD, HCEG, JCR, DATA, ZOO, RAB, sure there are others. All stocks GF has drawn people's attentions to, all posted negatively by Third Eye even though he has never owned them. Further apart from the ofex stock he has 90,000 or whatever of, I have never seen him post positively about anything on here. Bit like the spin department of a major political organisation!!

Given management's sad seeming reluctance to act decisively with regard to Third Eye, (my recent p-m contact did not receive even the courtesy of a reply, Ian)it is left to us as individual posters to point out this character's conduct on this site.

People caught on now to Third Eye's little crusade to discredit and abuse other posters rather than what he tries thinly to disguise as debate. He has no genuine interest in this share or the others i have highlighted here. I have seen him get banned elsewhere for precisely this sort of conduct and believe the same must happen here for the sake of this site.

And why does he only post on threads by GF or Hawick but never "warns" people about other stocks he doesn't own. Even warned people not to buy NLR for weeks - he was worried about management pay, Aim listing for US stock, unrealistic forecasts, then announced with utter brass neck on another site he'd bought them.

Clearly not a poster we can trust, as I have long suspected.

If i had more funds available for this sector i would be adding to RAB at these levels. Recent broker note said fair value 57p, giving a potential 60% upside.

Just don't be surprised if he appears as a RAB shareholder at some point, despite his scaremongering about investigations into hedge funds etc.

You see ThirdEye. booohhhhhhhhhhh

This thread gets funnier every time i read it. It seems that Third Eye is the only poster with the slightest grasp of the fundamentals of investing. I have posted before that I see RAB as a good long term investment, but that I agreed with Third Eye that it was overpriced. Why do you all persist in refusing to recognise the risks associated with a stock, and the fact that it was overpriced due to hyping, both in the financial press and on this and similar boards. If you do not understand the market put your money in a bank account. Do not take criticism of a stock as a personal criticism of yourselves. Third Eye has offered nothing but valid criticism of this stock based on sound financial analysis. Just because he does not see the possible positive side of a stock is not a basis for abusing him personally.

Thankyou Sharecaster for a bit of common sense (long overdue).

I'm ambivalent about the valuation of this share at the moment - I think the rise was overdone (too many punters following momentum and not buying on fundamentals) but I now suspect the fall might be overdone too. I won't be buying just yet though.

Third Eye's biggest holding was bought at levels up to 110p. The company now has turnover of 48k for the last six months, losses and the shares are about 10p, grasp lol!!! He still holds.
I have never denied the risks here, but the fall is overdone and I have read the analysts note and agree that 57p is fair value. Current price 35p strong buy imho.

Check out the link from Janus on the Bioprogress thread--it will make you all realise that there is a lot going on we know nothing about!