Fred1new
- 06 Jan 2009 19:21
Will this increase or decrease the likelihood of terrorist actions in America, Europe and the rest of the world?
If you were a member of a family murdered in this conflict, would you be seeking revenge?
Should Tzipi Livni and Ehud Olmert, be tried for war crimes if or when this conflict comes to an end?
What will the price of oil be in 4 weeks time?
Haystack
- 13 Apr 2011 14:57
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That will be changing very soon. The lack of democracy has hindered the will of the Arab people regarding Israel. The dictatorships in the Arab world have largely been propped up by the US in an attempt to thwart Arab action over Palestine. That era is now coming to an end.
Egyptian is the furthest along this road to democracy and the Egyptian Foreign Minister has already expressed his feelings about the behaviour of Israel. Hopefully this undercurrent of feelings will turn into action across the Arab world as democracy increases. Arabs in Israel don't have access to democracy. They are still discrimintated against within Israel socially and legally. It is only non Arabs that have real democracy in Israel.
cynic
- 13 Apr 2011 15:03
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reminder - must get that lamp rubbed harder!
In The Land of the B
- 13 Apr 2011 15:26
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"Arabs in Israel don't have access to democracy. "
You've just got to twist and distort and lie, haven't you ?
Your credibility even amongst the most credulous is rock bottom.
How else do you think an Arab MP gets elected to the Knesset?
And can you imagine how someone saying that wouldn't be arrested for treason in most other countries ?
Parrot, you deny reality as in this prime example. You think like a nazi and you are one.
Haystack
- 13 Apr 2011 15:53
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And when Arab members get elected they get suspended and have their passports taken if they say things that Netenyahu doesn't like. The Arab MP I mentioned above has had her Parlimentary privilieges removed including her dimplomatic passport because she was on the last freedom flotilla and gave evidence to the UN committee that resulted in charges of crimes against humanity being brough against Israel. She is taking Israeli high court action over the affair. This is the way that Israel attempts to silence people. Even her entitlement to financial aid for legal assistance was remoived to make it difficult for her fight the case.
cynic
- 13 Apr 2011 15:54
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ITLOB - enlighten me; there must surely be some form of registration in israel to permit you to vote, just as there is anywhere - e.g. you can't vote even in uk if you are not registered on the electoral roll - so what are the very basic rules ?
Haystack
- 13 Apr 2011 16:05
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The population figures are 20% Arab in Israel, yet they only have 12 out of 120 seats in parliament. People in Israel vote for parties and not candidates. There are percentage figures for a party to acheive to get a seat. Those % figures ahve been gradually raised.
cynic
- 13 Apr 2011 16:10
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that was not the question ..... actually, given that they only have 20% of the population, then 12% isn't that bad if you accept that many won't be registered and/or under-age and/or can't be bothered to vote
Haystack
- 13 Apr 2011 16:11
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All citizens 18 or over can vote.
Haystack
- 13 Apr 2011 16:13
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"actually, given that they only have 20% of the population, then 12% isn't that bad if you accept that many won't be registered and/or under-age and/or can't be bothered to vote"
That makes no sense as the proportion of the population in other groupings would have the same percentage of under age, non registered and not bothered. Therefore 20% shouls still equate with 20% of the seats.
cynic
- 13 Apr 2011 17:09
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ah, so it's all citizens, rather like if you are a bangla in uk and haven't registered to vote, you can't though you will still be counted in the census (assuming you're not an illegal) ..... doesn't sound very unfair to me
you also assume that "other groupings would have the same percentage of under age, non registered and not bothered", which is assuredly not so even in uk
Haystack
- 14 Apr 2011 03:45
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European Platform for the Academic and Cultural Boycott of Israel
Academic Boycott of Israel and the Complicity of Israeli Academic Institutions in Occupation of Palestinian Territories
http://www.epacbi.eu/articles/academic-boycott-israel-and-complicity-israeli-academic-institutions-occupation-palestinian
U.S. Campaign for the Academic & Cultural Boycott of Israel
http://usacbi.wordpress.com/
cynic
- 14 Apr 2011 07:11
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whoops! didn't like where that last post was leading, so let's go off at a tangent ..... no sruprises then
Haystack
- 14 Apr 2011 12:28
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Israel's Foreign Minister Avigdor Lieberman, a former nightclub bouncer, accused of money laundering.
http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/world/la-fg-israel-lieberman-20110414,0,570401.story?track=rss
April 13, 2011
Reporting from Jerusalem Israel's attorney general moved Wednesday to possibly indict Foreign Minister Avigdor Lieberman on fraud and other corruption charges, capping a decade-old investigation into the leader of the hawkish Yisrael Beiteinu party.
The announcement of the top justice official's intention to indict raised questions about the political future of Lieberman, who many suspect was preparing to challenge Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu in the next election.
The case also could destabilize Netanyahu's government; Lieberman has the power to bring down the coalition by withdrawing his party's adherence, though he has said that he does not intend to do so.
Lieberman could face charges of fraud, aggravated fraud, breach of trust, money-laundering and harassing a potential witness.
Isaacs
- 14 Apr 2011 12:40
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If only the leaders of the other countries in the Middle East were subject to the same laws and indeed the rule of law.
Fred1new
- 14 Apr 2011 12:54
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Or even this country!
Haystack
- 14 Apr 2011 14:43
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Of course there are all the allegations of corruption, fraud etc against Netanyahu over the years that he has managed to side step. He is even under investigation at present.
In The Land of the B
- 14 Apr 2011 17:11
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Funny the way the parrot only points up the weaknesses or crimes of Jews, (and what did you expect - Jews and Israelis are like everybody else, good bad and everything in between)NEVER his Hamas or Hizbollah terrorist friends.
Raging nazi anti-semite.
Haystack
- 14 Apr 2011 21:08
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LOL
As usual, simple logic defies you.
You should read Norman Finkelstein, who is a Jew. His father was in Auschwitz, his mother was in the Majdanek concentration camp and both were in the Warsaw Ghetto. The rest of his relatives all died in concentration camps. He is strongly opposed to the way Israel behaves towards Palestinians. He has met and supports Hizbollah. He has been to Israel, Gaza and the West Bank many times. One of his books is called "The Holocaust Industry". It is a book about how some people make money out of the holocaust. Another is called "This time we went too far" and is about the Israeli invasion of Gaza.
How do you explain his attitude. Is he a "Raging Nazi anti-semite"?
In The Land of the B
- 14 Apr 2011 21:35
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No, of course he isn't.
What you don't seem to grasp is that Jews and Israelis are like everybody else, good bad and everything in between AND a full range of views across the whole spectrum from extreme left to extreme right from ultra-religious (nutters in my view) to atheists.
As it happens I disagree strongly with a lot of the policies of the current Israeli government, including some of the actions during Cast Lead but not all. Military action was necessary to fight back against the constant daily hail of rockets and missiles but, as in all wars and particularly those fought in an urban environment there are tragic consequences sometimes for annocent civilians. Of course it doesn't help that Hamas deliberately put their fighters in amongst civilians in the hope of dissuading the IDF from fighting in specific situations for fear of harming them. Hamas view it as a win-win because if and inevitably when civilians get hurt or killed it has great propaganda value world wide and especially amongst the blind like parrot.
And yes, some of the settlers are religious nutters who create problems by settling on what I regard as the future territory of an independent Palestine.
And yes, such settlements should be stopped by the Israeli government. The problem as usual is the perfect electoral proportional representation system in Israel which permits the religious nutters to have enough votes in the Knesset to get their way.
I can tell you there is considerable resentment against them by the majority of secular Israelis.
Yes, they were right to stop ships trying to break the blockade and the people who were killed put themselves in harm's way by attacking the sailors as they abseiled down.
Yes, they were wrong in stopping some of the non-military goods getting into Gaza, but right to stop material with war uses.
It is a war.
If Hamas recognised Isreal and gave up its demand of her destruction and stopped launching rockets then a peaceful settlement would come.
Till then, it's war.
The problem with the parrot is that he is so anti-semitic and anti-Israel and refuses to be objective that he is an extremist and if he wants the destruction of the only mainly Jewish state in the world, he is assuredly a nazi anti-semite.
Parrot lives in a different world if he thinks that Hamas and Hizbollah and Iran (and the other Arab states he calls on to make war on Israel) would do anything other than wipe out every Jew they could get their hands on. Another Holocaust is what he wants. That's why he's a nazi.
Freddiefewbrains is just a far left fanatic.
fahel sympathises with his fellow Muslims and that colours his attitude. That's fine, he's being true to his Ummah and I can see that.
Parrot, however, has none of those reasons for wanting events which would inevitably lead to a second Holocaust and that is why he is the only true evil nazi on this board.
Haystack
- 14 Apr 2011 22:59
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It is an interesting double standard that you operate. You said above that you do not think Norman Finkelstein is anti-semitic. I am not sure why that is. In fact Israel considers him to be anti-semitic and has banned him from Israel for 10 years. He is far more anti-Israel than I am.
I am not anti-semitic, but I am anti-Israel. Not to the people of Israel, but the government and its expansionist policies. The various international investigators found no evidence of Hamas using human shields, but Israeli soldiers didnand have admitted such. You will find Norman Finkelstein saying the same thing.
In fact he regards Hamas firing rockets were in response to Israel's agression and not the other way round. Iran is certainly crazy or rather some of their leaders are. Hamas and Hizbollah have no intention of wiping out Jews and nor do I. As usual you have no evidence for your assertions. Israel should never have been created and that is really the problem.
Hamas have repeatedly that they would be happy to return to 1967 boundaries as a solution. It is Israel that stops the peace process. It is quite clear from the leaked PA documents that huge concessions were offered by the PA to Israel and Israel ignored them. Those concessions could not now be offered again. In fact it looks likely that the PA dare not sign a peace treaty at all now. The response from Hamas and Hizbollah would be very fast. Israel makes it quite clear that they don't want peace by the continued settlements of the West Bank and East Jerusalem.