Thought I'd start a new thread as this is going to be a major talking point this year...have not made up my mind yet...(unlike bucksfizz)....but thinking of voting for an exit as Europe is not doing Britain any good at all it seems....

Dilbert,

I didn't vote in either 2015 or in 2017, but, before that, my Conservative votes were based upon their economic policies.

Actually, I think the so-called "British democracy" has a lot of faults and weaknesses.

Some of which are being exposed at the moment.


Possibly, the present "uproar" and "upheaval" may speed up reasoned changes and the evolution of rules and "process". (Not easy with some having too many irons in the fire or holding promissory notes.)

CNG.

"I would expect Labour to also lose votes because of Corbyn's (lack of) Brexit stance."


At the moment, I think (guess) like Corbyn is doing if he made any direct statement of policy or intent about putting a motion of no-confidence in the government, or calling for a New Referendum his statements would be jumped upon by the present Conservatives and media as "crazy policies" and be a distraction from the "mess" the present "individuals" thought to be in charge of a failing government.

He is probably thinking let the T.May's ship sink and then examine the flotsam and jetsam which washes up on the shore.

He hasn't seen the books of the negotiations or the false promises made.

Why be pilloried when he doesn't have to be.

He doesn't have to start walking the tightrope yet.

( Or put the noose around his own neck.)

hilary (CNG or whatever) - it would not at all surprise me to see another hung parliament ...... for differing reasons, the voting public now regards MP's and politics in general in a similar light as 2nd-hand car salesmen in some sleazy sidestreet ..... the worrying thing is, that as the moderate masses vote in fewer numbers, so the door is left wide open for the extremists of (m)any hues

easy to become a conspiracist :-)

Fred,

I don't have any issue whatsoever with how Corbyn is playing things. There are two sides to every market - a right side, and a wrong side. When the sh!t finally looks like it's about to hit the fan, JC just needs to be sure that he's on the right side.

There will, however, be a bit of collateral damage in the shorter term, so it's important to manage the risk/reward ratio lest he gets too many splinters whilst fence sitting.

Cyners,

Referenda are, by their very nature, divisive. Therefore, there will be a period of uncertainty, and opinions will inevetibly shoot both ways, whilst a new status quo is sought, but everything will eventually return to the centre ground which is where all political battles are won. Extremism, of whatever guise, has no place in modern society.

And feel free to use whichever moniker you choose. My laptop froze completely last year after a Windows update and I temporarily lost access to a whole load of stuff. I had to get the machine back to the UK, and then get it returned, so it was simpler to just buy a new laptop and create a new £am account in the meantime.

I never realised how frightening you could be.

-=-==--=

By how many will TM proposal be rejected on Tues.

40-50?

The BBC have suggested 228, which has been latched upon by the pugnacious red tops. My personal guess is circa 150. Anything under 100, and I'm inclined to agree with Martini insofar as she'll get the deal through second time around.

Nah.

Big week apparently...which way are you voting this time then Dil...in or out?

"everything will eventually return to the centre ground which is where all political battles are won. Extremism, of whatever guise, has no place in modern society."


true, but as we have seen throughout history, the pendulum can take a long time to swing back to neutral, and in the meantime, the extremists can wreak havoc

Extremists? you mean like this lot you voted for Alf?

You really are a laugh a minute you pompous Tories.

“Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.”
― Mark Twain

Well Alf?

well posted IT and well noted .... many thanks

Be careful Manuel.

THEY are after you and your wallet!

Cyners,

The extremists have already wreaked havoc. Cameron called a referendum that he thought he'd win, rememember?

Now somebody's got the tricky job of keeping the UK within the EU without fanning the flames further, and breeding further discontent.

cameron got himself rather forced into a corner if i remember correctly

that the campaign was probably poorly managed and of course corbyn's supposed support of remain was lukewarm at best, all contributed

He saw it as a way to stop Conservative votes bleeding to UKIP, and to unite a disjointed Conservative party. He was complacent after narrowly keeping Scotland in the UK, but hadn't reckoned on Dominic Cummings' smart Vote Leave campaign management in a digital age which was highly targeted towards the right demographic.

that doesn't exactly make cameron an extremist, but no matter though that may not be quite what you meant - eg he arguably opened the door for them