Thought I'd start a new thread as this is going to be a major talking point this year...have not made up my mind yet...(unlike bucksfizz)....but thinking of voting for an exit as Europe is not doing Britain any good at all it seems....

Like parliamentary expenses and tory political stunts like a referendum?

We need honest governments.

8-)

Now, where did I leave my expense claim?

Cheers Hils.

I tend to agree with It in that whatever May gets past Parliament will be agreed by the EU at the last minute with a technical extension of a couple of weeks or so to ratify it.

If they don't then no deal will occur by default but then a quick fix will be found by both sides in a matter of days / maybe a week or so.

After that , Burnley is welcome to a second referendum as far as I'm concerned.

Exactly Fred the idea that most of Europe is not exceptable to the UK and is a reason to leave but alongside that the fact that our Ministers have been on the fiddle for years without being exposed, and even then have been let off when found guilty relatively and still been allowed to be MPs is a nonsense in itself.

Double standards anyone?

NO.

Normal con artists and old boys' behaviour!

Now that is exceptable-):

There is a special place in hell for them

Just as well there were no BBs when Bulwer-Lytton wrote that the pen is mightier than the sword. Reading Stan and Ollie is like getting struck by a feather duster.

I understand that Ollie is on the fat side, so that will leave Stan as the dimwitted one. Apt.

Marti and IT,

What a pair of little squirts you are!

The usual sarky stuff and abuse from the abusers Fred still I expect they enjoy their own company if nobody else does.

So says DT who clearly is getting worried.
"Donald Tusk
@eucopresident
I've been wondering what that special place in hell looks like, for those who promoted #Brexit, without even a sketch of a plan how to carry it out safely."

Tusk will look a plonker if the Irish will not build a border - what will the EU do then?

Desperate to keep the UK in stating:
"I know that still a very great number of people in the UK, and on the continent, as well as in Ireland, wish for a reversal of this decision. I have always been with you, with all my heart.

"But the facts are unmistakable. At the moment, the pro-Brexit stance of the UK prime minister, and the Leader of the Opposition, rules out this question.

"Today, there is no political force and no effective leadership for Remain. I say this without satisfaction, but you can't argue with the facts."

But coming to the facts of the matter that the people will not be pushed around by Tusk and Co.

And there was I agreeing with the Stan and Oliver that the expensive fiddlers should rot in hell. No pleasing some sigh.

PS when is the informal referendum Stan?

So says DT who clearly is getting worried.
"Donald Tusk
@eucopresident
I've been wondering what that special place in hell looks like, for those who promoted #Brexit, without even a sketch of a plan how to carry it out safely."



That to me is a fair summation of the political shenanigans initiated by Cameron and Osborne and continued by the most inept government in modern time.

Wait for Theresa to come back clutching in her hand a bit of in her hand and bleating "peace in our time" for the tory party".

Could be worse , could come back clutching that straw you and Stan are clinging onto.

Tusk can see his 39 billion slipping away , he's getting worried and so he should.

"Carry it out Safely"?

We alll know what happend to Chamberlain when he came back waving that piece of paper - and against all odds the UK then had a leader that took charge and went to war and won against all the odds.

I guess nothing will change but this time around it is The Economic Wars with no blood letting.

From Fred's rag

Concerns over the health of the German economy are mounting this morning, after Europe’s largest economy suffered another big fall in manufacturing orders.

Germany factory orders plunged by 1.6% in December, new figures released this morning show, due to weak demand from overseas.

That’s much worse than the 0.3% rise which economists had expected, and follows a 0.2% decline in November.

I hope the Guardian figures are correct, hate to have to apologise to Stan again

CT.

Then the UK had the "support of the empire".

Also, the USA saved the0 "bacon" of Great Britain when it "reluctantly" entered the WW2.

George,

Have a look at the projections for the UK if we leave the EU. (A soft Brexit may be gentler and may be possible, but the relationships with Europe will be very little different from what it is now, except the UK will be waiting at the table with little or no influence on the menu.)

(As I intimated back in 2016.)