Will this increase or decrease the likelihood of terrorist actions in America, Europe and the rest of the world?

If you were a member of a family murdered in this conflict, would you be seeking revenge?

Should Tzipi Livni and Ehud Olmert, be tried for war crimes if or when this conflict comes to an end?

What will the price of oil be in 4 weeks time?

Clubman

Stick your title where the sun don't shine Robbie

That would be anywhere in your ignorant, misinformed, bigotted, sad and lonely little racist life, would it?

the next flotilla ?

Dhows 'r us ?

lol

It is going to be a tough call. Once again Israel will be stuck with difficult choices. Either they drop the blockade or do something that will be a PR coup for Hamas. More isolation will then follow. Of course now the genie is out of the bottle. Dropping the blockade will not be enough anymore. Hamas now know how to manipulate the media and next it may be stop building settlements and then removing existing ones. Hamas will just keep coming up with more situations where Israel will go over the top.

The next flotilla is planned for six weeks. Israel have not got much time to come up with a new answer.

they already have the answer

its a blockade

next time its a hole thru the bows

of course there may be some delay while hamas try to find another 40 reporters who want to take the trip

lol

There are a few on here that should go given how much they seem to care about Gaza and Hamas. My first vote is for Clubman - MoneyAM's new roving reporter on the scene. We can arrange for a special hat and a satellite bloomberg feed.

Haystack, Camelot - I agree.

Nobody is under any illusions here - this is a military blockade and Israel will use military methods to enforce it. Landing boarding troops armed with paint guns is the soft option. Israel will now have to get tougher. I'm being serious when I mention torpedoes and exocets.

Leaving aside the emotional aspects, the legal side is interesting and will govern how the next engagements take place.

I believe there will now be a rush to clarification as to whether or not the blockade is legal under international law. Haystack, I know your opinion on this, and you know mine. The legal experts, however, are still undecided.

If they decide that the blockade is illegal then Israel did indeed commit an act of piracy, and whilst I don't think anybody really accepts any similarity with the somalian pirates I do accept that the surprise pre-emptive engagement was a few hours too early.

If the blockade is legal then the law is clear; that Israel acted within international law, regardless of the location of the engagement.

I suspect that if the legal question is not resolved in time then Israel will again be compelled to use force, but will use it closer to Israeli/Gaza shores.

G

What's going on guys? There was less abuse on this thread when the peoples favourite (Dear old Fred) was posting :0) Amazed you have time to trade, obviously a less boring pastime eh?

No problem isaacs I would go if Bernie Madden could be my assistant, he has a proven track record of how to f*** them big time.

Even the FT called this interception "piracy". As far as I can see, they are wrong. If the blockade is legal - and it appears to be - then interception on the high seas is legal under the 1994 San Remo code. Interceptions of this sort are practised by the U.S. Coastguard and Navy, by the Royal Navy and other Navies, including the French and Chinese in dealing with drug traffickers and, er, real pirates.

MM -

I think that the legal position hinges on whether or not Israel are at war with Hamas. If a state of war exists then, as I understand it, the blockade is legal, as was boarding the ship in international waters.

The water is muddied because Hamas is not a country and the legal people are trying to establish whether or not you can be at war with an organisation.

CC: Yes, I was just thinking it would be nice to see this level of enthusiastic debate and interchange on the Traders' Thread . . .

Yuff
,
I question some of your statements:

1) I am not Jewish. Ideologically I am left and by profession a journalist. Why am I not anti- Israeli like my colleagues? Because as a non-Jew I have the historical responsibility to fight against Jewish hatred and currently against the hatred for their historic homeland, Israel .

I would suggest from some of your posting you dont uphold the principle you say you strive for. To me, you are often supporting with seemingly uncritical view of Israels political, military, humanitarian and sometime criminal actions.

(My historic home land, is probably England, but I wont claim it back, but some distance long lost ancestor lived there. We have moved on. Also I wont knock you house down, because I want what you have and doing so seems justifiable by ancient belief.

Many Americans are living on the land confiscated by the indigenous Indians. I cant see their rightful claims be held up in a court of Law.)

2) To fight against anti-Semitism is not the duty of the Jews, it is the duty of the non-Jews.

As a journalist it is my duty to search for the truth beyond prejudice, lies and manipulations

I would suggest, it is a responsibility for all to argue against (I question the word fight) prejudices, be they racial, cultural, political or religious.

There are religious Zealots within those holding Islamic, Jewish, Christian or Atheist beliefs. Some of the extremes of these groups when they also have self righteous intolerance to other views often attempt to use force and violence in attempt to subjugate or coerce others. They often enable and utilise change in the legal rights and humanitarian rights to achieve those ends. The driving out of Palestinians from their historically own land and confiscation of their property.

3) Principles that Islamic fundamentalism systematically destroys. That is to say that as a non-Jew, journalist and lefty, I have a triple moral duty with Israel , because if Israel is destroyed, liberty, modernity and culture will be destroyed too.

I think once again a sweeping statement. I believe that Persian Islamic states in the past have been far ahead of many western civilisations in the same period.

--------------------------

I think you are over valuing the relevance of the Israeli state in the Grand Scheme of Things. That does not infer that those of Jewish descent havent added to the cultural, and scientific advancement of civilised societies.

But the intransigence shown by recent Israeli administration in dealing with the obvious humanitarian problems is not endearing them to those outside their small country.


-------------------------------------


Regarding the recent affrays and attempt to run the gauntlet, I think the question should be asked is why the Palestinians and associates are doing what they are doing, Also what underlies the Israelis are refusing to have meaningful discussions.

Gausie: Like the war on terror or Al-Quaeda, perchance? Seems to me all of NATO went to war then.

Clarification of law on "the war on terror" is even more murky. Not only is it not a country, it's not even an organisation. It's a noun.

Israel cannot possibly risk the blockade falling until they are comfortable that the extremist countries such as Iran will not use Gaza as a weapons store and launchpad for ever more powerful explosives.

If Israel needs to sink blockade busting ships then 'believe me this': they will.

i think i'll absent (absinthe might be better) myself from posting here until all this verbosity and other garbage blows though

NM,

It is appalling to me, that some people choose martyrdom and murder, in order to further their causes.

But when, in spite of the Internet, attempts are made to suppress different views, many feel they have to resort to such methods.

Also, what many who support Israel over recent times, are unable to accept is that criticism of the state, is not out of blinkered "hatred".

The arrogance and responses shown by some posters, etc, is hopefully not representative of all members of the Israeli state.

In the past, I have criticised the actions of my children, and likewise they have criticise some of mine. The important thing is that, we don't think we hate each other.

Although, sometimes we agree to disagree non-violently.

The actions on both sides in this recent conflict shows immaturity.

PS,

I agree with Hay's comment.

Hays

Unless Israel negotiate with more concessions such as dismantling illegal settlements, they are going to become more isolated. Now that Hamas have seen the power of their new strategy you can expect more of the same. It doesn't help Israel that they have a very right wing Prime Minister. It doesn't help that he was a commander of a commando unit. Force seems to suit his style of government.

-----------------------------------

Cynic,

Give me you address and I will send you some old copies of the Beano.

Clubman3509 - 01 Jun 2010 14:53 - 2377 of 2402
Ban those silly little hats they wear on the back of their heads

Tell our father the Pope.

.

how can the blockade be illegal ?

Israelis are blockading Israeli waters

the rest is a propoganda pipe dream
probably on hash