Thought Id start this one going because its rather dead on this board at the moment and I suppose all my usual muckers are either at the Stella tennis event watching Dim Tim (lose again) or at Henly Regatta eating cucumber sandwiches (they wish,...NOT).

Anyway please feel free to just talk to yourself blast away and let it go on any company or subject you wish. Just wish Id thought of this one before.

cheers GF.

it's certainly an interesting question as to what involvement the church(es) should have in politics
in the middle ages, the church was very much a political and indeed military (knights of st john etc) force to be reckoned with
rushing forward to 20th century, i think we were all pretty appalled that the catholic church took no steps to condemn the ira and its atrocities, and now when the church does involve itself, we don't care for that either

it's a very fine balance

I vote for no involvement at all. Why do believers in extra terrestrial celestial beings feel qualified to comment on anything?

they are every bit as qualified as you and i, and as spiritual leaders of a great number of people, there is a strong argument that they owe their flock guidance

indeed, i would love to see the leaders of the jewish faith taking a stance against some of the actions perpetrated by the israeli gov't
i find their silence shameful

I suspect the church are getting involved because their is no real opposition from Labour MPs which is a disgrace.

Obviously keeping an eye on fiddled polls which are motivated by Tory lies about the scale of welfare which is very tiny compared to tax evasion and tax avoidance scumsters.

If just a small amount of this money was recovered it would pay for the whole welfare budget.

Brooks acquitted of misconduct in public office on direction of judge.

Just 1 charge.

Shel get done on the others.

Hopefully, she will get off on all charges. No one cares about phone hacking.

Shel be doing porridge, just wait and see.

No she wont.

Can you imagine the dirt she's got tucked away for a rainy day?

My local vicar is a delightful guy who leads by example and does a lot of good work for the local community. He tries to guide and help rather than instruct. I think religion should be used as a way of educating people on how to become decent human beings and to show that there are certain guidelines on how to behave in a civilised society. Sermon over !!

quite so doodle, but is that so far different from church leaders taking a moral stance on serious issues?

a difficult line to draw between that and taking political sides, which they have no right to do

I agree cynic, they shouldn't take political sides - just the same as our monarchy.

Why not?

They are as entitled to their opinions like everyone else.

the monarchy is brilliant at keeping an apolitical line

max - there is a massive difference between holding and even broadcasting a view as a private individual and propounding it as a church leader ..... for obvious reasons, church leaders cannot easily express a personal view without great care in so doing

The monarchy are brilliant at keeping the dirt well hidden.

They are no more apolitical than you or i.

shows what you don't know!

Does it?

Does what?

Anyway I think the Church are right in pointing out the fact that poor people are being abandoned by the state.

Im sure they would have done the same if labour were making a bollocks up like the Tories.

Certainly an under class developed under this coalition and in my book thats not ethicaly or moraly right.

The church have done the right and decent thing.

The signatories to the open letter condemning what Cameron calls his “Moral mission” of Welfare reforms, have a perfect right to do so.

As “elected” church leaders they represent the views of a large group of similar thinking individuals, who think differently to the present government leadership.
They have an influence on the present and changing morality of the UK society they live in

Like any other group, whether they are the Unions, Professional bodies, Bankers, Bookies. CPI, Business representatives, etc..

It is their responsibility to speak out against what they see as punitive moral changes and to do so as effectively as the can do.

Perhaps, if the Churches had spoken out against Hitler or Mussolini in his early days then Europe may not have gone through the savagery it did.

I would wager if the 27 signatories had spoken out in favour of Cameron and his motley crew, they would have been invited to No 10, at the front door and Cameron would have been beamingly welcoming them on the doorsteps.

I admire the Orthodox Church in Kiev opening its door to act as a hospital for injured protesters.

I think in general the churches; similar organisation and religion in general have done more good than harm and act a civilizing influence on societies.

The only problem I have is when they support their arguments with a God.

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