Thought I'd start a new thread as this is going to be a major talking point this year...have not made up my mind yet...(unlike bucksfizz)....but thinking of voting for an exit as Europe is not doing Britain any good at all it seems....

Haystack , we are OUT !!!!

Hope so.

M&G have now suspended trading in their property funds.

Oh dear, Ol' Ken has been gossiping out of church.

Veteran Tory MP Ken Clarke has been caught on camera ridiculing the Conservative's leadership candidates.
The former cabinet minister was waiting to be interviewed by Sky News when he was recorded giving his opinions to fellow guest Sir Malcolm Rifkind about the "fiasco" that is the Tory contest.
He warned that Michael Gove would "go to war with at least three countries at once" if he became Prime Minister, while describing Theresa May as "a bloody difficult woman".
He added that Andrea Leadsom would have to understand that "she's not to deliver on some of the extremely stupid things she's been saying".

It was an interesting insight into the election process. He has a habit of being indiscreet, but usually off camera. Malcolm Rifkind didn't say much in reply. I thought the interestig part was the Theresa May comment "she is a bloody difficult woman, but we both worked for Mrs Thatcher"

there are good arguments for and against both leadsom and may being the next leader, but on balance i would still vote for may

No wonder Ken was being so candid, looked like he had bin at the holy water.

165 votes for Theresa
66 Andrea
Gove 48
Crabb 34
Fox out

May has more than 50% of all votes

If elected, it seems Andrea Leadsom might well say immediately to the large number of EU immigrants, who have settled here during the past few years and have even bought houses, etc, etc, that they have no need to fear for their jobs or other aspects of the 'security of tenure' of their personal lives. At the same time, she would undoubtedly affirm, that they are not going to become part of a negotiation 'thingy' with the EU concerning British people who are in similar circumstances but living in parts of the EU.

She will similarly say, tthat neither are they going to become part of a trade agreement deal with the EU.

Then it would be up to the EU, now having seen what Britain has said, to act similarly with our people who work, live or have retired to the EU. ie. They are not going to be bundled up regardles of personal circumstance and sent back to their home country.

In other words, she will quickly affirm, that the EU immigrants can 'rest easy'.

Now that is NOT what Theresa May is saying about how she is going to treat this problem.

People always measure other people using their own yardstick of measurement. They don't like using the other person's yardstick. This is going to create a fear in people about Theresa May. She is deeply suspicious, lacks a generosity of spirit and one would always want to be exceedingly careful about how she is likely to behave and on the decisions she is likely to take.

In the opposite way, treating the EU migrants quickly and generously like this, is going make the EU ands their immigrants have a high regard for Andrea Leadsom and also feel that they can trust her generosity of spirit.

These two different 'aspects of attitude' towards the same problem are going to be the sort of thing that is going to win the hearts and minds of people over to Andrea. Of course, by 'people' latterly, I mean Conservative Party Members.

Andrea wants to get going with things, create stability and create good will.

Andrea will win hands down.

It won't matter what Andrea says. Labour will force a vote in Parliament tomorrow (Wednesday) calling on the Government to allow EU citizens currently living in the UK permission to remain.

Labour’s motion calls for the Government to allow EU citizens, residing lawfully in the UK prior to the EU Referendum, the right to stay and explicitly rules out their use as ‘bargaining chips’.

Haystack

165 votes for Theresa
66 Andrea
Gove 48
Crabb 34
Fox out

May has more than 50% of all votes.

My wife reminded me, that each Tuesday and Thursday, Conservative MP voting will take place, dropping out the one bottom candidate at a time, until the list of candidates is down to the final two. Then the choice is given to the Conservative Party Members as a whole to vote on 'Who gets it?' out of the final two and all to be decided by 9 September.

All as per THE RULES and stuff

The con mp's wont give a shit about any of that, they will be jockying for position.

4269 - i think it absolutely right that eu immigrants with proper credentials - whatever that may mean - should be assured of their security in uk

Andrea is in full agreement with that Labour motion.

It seems Theresa isn't.

Andrea will get liked for her viewpoint, which is generous and reasonable.

Theresa will get disliked for the opposite viewpoint, which is not generous and reasonable and is purely political.

So cynic, I agree with you.

Theresa is in agreement as are all MPs. Some just want to make sure our citizens are being treated the same. It is a lot of fus about nothing as they will clearly be allowed to stay.

You might change your mind when Article 50 is activated and there is a rush for EU citizens to come here to beat the two year leave deadline.

I found out something interesting. The Labour vote will make no difference. They are just playing politics.

Opposition day motions aren't binding. EU/UK status will be subject to Brexit negotiation once it starts.

When art50 is activated, are we then free merchants in that we can make our own laws?

ie, sprout law no longer applies?

NO. We then have to wait at least two more years and possibly longer if the EU agrees to an extension. During that period as many EUs can come here as they want. It looks like we will guarantee that they can stay forever.

I asked about laws.

However, the immigrant thing is relevant, will we be able to impose our own qualification rules? Otherwise, it will for sure be a free for all.

No. We are subject to EU laws until we leave.