Banks in the US, Asia and many in Europe reported better than expected results.
Consider RBS and HSBC, the two competitors. Both have done well.

I expect LLoy do the same.

89.5p +4.3p

Lloyds increasing maximum ECN amount

Lloyds Bank is increasing the maximum enhanced capital notes new issue amount under the non US exchange offer from 5.5bn to 7.0bn.

The bank announced two exchange offers on 3 November.

These related to certain existing securities for enhanced capital notes guaranteed by Lloyds or Lloyds TSB Bank plc, or, in the case of the non US exchange offer, an exchange consideration amount to be satisfied in new shares and/or cash and/or additional ECNs.

It said: "As a result of high levels of investor interest following the 3 November 2009 announcement, Lloyds has decided if required, to utilise the maximum flexibility incorporated in the exchange offers proposals to satisfy potential investor demand by increasing the maximum ECN new issue amount under the non US exchange offer from 5.5bn to 7.0bn.

"In the event that take-up under the non US exchange offer does not reach 7.0bn, Lloyds will consider increasing the maximum ECN new issue amount in the US exchange offer in accordance with its terms."

Rush to swap debt for equity prompts Lloyds to consider raising 1.5bn more

Darling says banks must reform bonus culture - report

Fri 13 Nov, 2009 09:00
LONDON (Reuters) - Banks have still failed to grasp the need to reform their bonus culture, but Britain is unwilling to legislate to force them to take action, Chancellor Alistair Darling said in a newspaper interview on Friday.

Speaking to the Wall Street Journal's European edition, Darling said many banking executives appear to have forgotten that public money bailed out large parts of their industry.

"The mentality in the boardroom seems to ignore the fact everybody else in the country has helped them out," Darling was quoted as saying. "There are far too many people in the banking world who haven't caught the change in sentiment. There has to be a change in culture."


The question of bankers' bonuses has triggered a political and public outcry in Britain and around the world and prompted calls for tougher curbs on their pay packages.

Despite the state aid that rescued parts of the banking industry, Darling said some bank bosses had sought a return to pre-crisis bonus pools.

"The first instincts of too many people in these institutions is to say 'what can we pay out', rather than 'what can we pay in'," Darling said.

However, he again ruled out passing new laws to limit bonuses and said taking such a move unilaterally would harm the British economy.

"I do not want to disadvantage Britain," Darling added.

Britain last week ploughed another 30 billion pounds into the country's banks as part of a major restructuring forced by European Union competition rules.

That followed a huge government bailout last year which saw Britain take stakes in its major banks to prevent a financial collapse.

Darling said former shareholders of Britain's failed banks must shoulder part of the blame.

"They didn't take their stewardship seriously," he said. "There are huge questions to be asked about the role of shareholders in these businesses."

On the global economy, Darling said there was "still a lot of uncertainty around" and more risks to be negotiated, such as rising unemployment in the United States.

Lloyds takes 600m hit on Admiral pubs

Lloyds Banking Group has been forced to swallow a 600m debt-for-equity swap at Admiral Taverns, the pubs group, in the latest fallout from the banking groups ill-fated merger last year with rival HBOS.

The deal, which could come this week in the form of a pre-pack administration, will force Lloyds to take control of Admiral, one of Britains largest pub groups, after it fell behind on repayment of more than 1 billion in debts.

LLOYDS TO UNVEIL CUT-PRICE ISSUE

LLOYDS Banking Group is thought to be prepared to sell new shares to investors at a cut price 50p a share in order to ensure its UK record 13.5 billion rights issue does not flop.

Good to hear that. The expected issue price has risen from 35p to 55p a share and we have lots of time until 24th when the price will be decided.

We should also consider that the asset value of companies including Lloyds is increasing every day. For instance, Lloyds holds 12% of WKP risen over 10% in two days.

9m shares traded at 89.85 at the close on Friday.

the pair of you are not being exact.
regards
jkd

jkd, don't worry about it. Just make sure that you have cash available at the specified date to take up the rights if you want. That's the crucial issue, imo. All the rest is just speculation.
Interesting to see that many of the big BARC holders were allegedly selling out to have cash available for the LLOY issue. Not long to go now.

A late surge at 4pm most likely from the US, but only finished 1p UP

The negative comment at the weekend press keep the shares down on the morning, despite the FTSE rising strongly.

I think it should hit 87p again shortly. May bounce, but probably won't. Not sure what the uptake will be, but I sold my holding a while ago and can wait.

So you won't have any Rights allocation Fred? The last lot were certainly worth having, which doesn't necessarily mean this lot will be, but am reasonably optimistic.

Damian Reece -- Published: 12:04PM GMT 16 Nov 2009

Bankers and traders will kick and scream at the idea of individual contracts being subject to state scrutiny, although I'm confident most will find their way through the manifold loopholes which such remuneration law generally contains. Their employers likewise will join the cacophony of protest at what look fairly unconstitutional proposals.

There will be plenty of noise from another constituency too, but this time it will be the sound of popping Champagne corks. From what we know, the Bill looks like a massive work creation scheme for the City's law firms, whose remuneration, it seems, is not affected by the proposals.

We can expect a "bonus transfer" to a degree, from bankers to those lawyers employed to protect their incomes. For the economy as a whole, lawyers will take up the slack so estate agents and car dealers can keep ticking over. Phew. So far as lawyers are capable of being brash (most are too sensible to indulge in ostentatious displays of wealth) we should at least expect some loosening of the top button after this week's Queen's Speech.

No, the group who have most to lose but who will fail to make their justifiable case heard are shareholders, particular the big institutional shareholders who manage our savings and pensions.

With its suite of banking reforms, including pay, the Government is effectively wresting a huge amount of ownership control from shareholders and taking it for itself - without compensation.

Banks, especially in the UK, are becoming answerable primarily to the state for their actions, with shareholders fast becoming a poor second.

To some extent this is fair. Without the taxpayer standing behind all banks, shareholders would have faced complete wipe out. As it is they still have an economic interest in a sector beginning to revive. They have seen huge amounts of their value wiped out - certainly at Lloyds Banking Group and Royal Bank of Scotland - but such zombies have at least been given the chance to live again.

Anyway, much of this value destruction was down to the status of "absentee landlord" which most institutions adopted in the run up to Northern Rock and the ensuing crisis.

But this justification for state intervention only goes so far.

The entire economy benefited from the emergency action instigated by Government. It wasn't just the denizens of the Square Mile, Canary Wharf and Mayfair who contributed to the crisis.

Many other groups were culpable. Many businesses took excessive risks. Consumers were irresponsible as were politicians and regulators.

Yet no other industry is being targeted with specific laws, even though management allowed terrific risks to be taken and, in many cases, lost.

That's because it is not deemed appropriate for the state to intervene. It's for shareholders to decide if management is doing its job properly - if not then shareholders have the power to act, to terminate employment subject to contract.

Banks, it is argued, are different and require specific laws applicable to them because of the risks they pose to the system as a whole. Tougher rules on banks' capital requirements and liquidity are therefore being introduced internationally.

In the UK, banks will have to disclose how they can be wound up in emergency and retail banking separated from investment banking without the former being infected by the latter.

These are all reasonably sensible. But individual terms of employment were not to blame for the credit crisis - that was caused by a toxic confluence of behaviour encouraged by the easy availability of cheap money - a situation blessed by regulators and law makers the world over.

Laws that allow the state to nullify contracts already signed between two private parties are bad laws.

Regulators will ultimately have to rely on some highly subjective and debatable opinions as to what constitutes remuneration that threatens the stability of the financial system as a whole.

That's why the Financial Services Bill is a lawyers' charter.

But more fundamentally we cannot allow the state to use this crisis to limit our freedoms further.

Bankers may not be the most edifying bunch to defend but there are important principles at stake. It's up to shareholders to stand up for their ownership rights and not allow contract law to be so brazenly usurped by the state.

But these days they seem more interested in box-ticking corporate governance measures. The sort of thing that last week saw a bunch of them getting in an entirely mistaken lather about the non-executive roles of Sir Philip Hampton, chairman of the Royal Bank of Scotland.

Sadly, shareholders seem incapable of organising themselves into an effective voice or being able to adopt effective strategies. Many of them are the sort of blue chip organisations that the Government is wholly reliant on when it comes to the functioning of the gilts market, for instance.

This is a market without which the Government's runaway deficit would be impossible to fund. Institutions are not without leverage. They should start to use it before it's too late.

Harry,

I haven't held on for the rights offer and sold what I held a little while ago.

I find the Banks accounts and valuations to complex for me to understand and my previous holds were based on comment, simple understanding of basic fundamentals and the charts.

But in the present market turmoil, I feel that the share price may drop back to rights price if not below it.

If I was to buy, I would prefer to see the prices after the offer and buy accordingly.

I may have missed 5-10% profit, but happy buy on a uptrending share price.

Good luck if you hold.

I would think in 2years time it will have returned a decent overall profit.

RNS chairman Sir Win Bischoff buys 250,000 shares @ 89p.

He can afford to!
8-)

They are moving well ahead now, they have reached 92.50p a few minutes ago, up 2p while the market is down
and the rest of the banks also, though RBS wants to follow LLOY


On 16th November 2009, 250,000 ordinary shares of 25p each in Lloyds Banking
Group were purchased by Chase Nominees Limited on Sir Winfried Bischoff's behalf
at 89.691p per share.

just tooo much money around. Revaluation (assets and mortgage market) will move it to ... up

Not sure I agree with you Fred about the drop in the sp. My feeling is that there is a great deal of cash about waiting to take up the rights (assuming the price is favourable) so I would expect the issue to be very popular, thus supporting the sp.
Of course, each to their own strategy. Med term, I agree that LLOY are a good investment.

from Investors Chronicle .................

Bank stock picks
Created: 17 November 2009
Written by: Nic Clarke

In the last two weeks, there have been numerous announcements covering third-quarter trading, capital raisings and the UK Government Asset Protection Scheme (APS). We felt that there would be clear winners and losers due to the financial crisis and events over the last couple of weeks support that view.

Standard Chartered, which we recommend investors accumulate, has been our favoured bank through the crisis. It is the only bank share that is trading above its pre-crisis levels. The wholesale bank reported a strong and broad-based third-quarter income performance, with expenses under control and a low impairment charge. In its consumer bank, which has suffered in recent quarters, income has grown despite margin pressure on the deposit side and impairments have fallen. We also like the group's strong liquidity.

We also have recommended 'accumulating' shares in HSBC. Profitability for the first nine months of the year was stronger than expected. Global Banking & Markets maintained its record performance, and although loan impairment declined in its US consumer finance unit (in run-off), the improvement may prove temporary.

Despite strong investment banking results, Barclays' shares are a hold. Profits fell back in the first nine months of 2009 due to higher impairments. Parts of the retail business are struggling, but Barclays said impairments may peak this year rather than in the first half of 2010, and it has restarted paying dividends.

We also recommend holding Lloyds Banking Group shares. It announced that it does not intend to participate in the government APS and is to raise 13.5bn in a rights issue and at least 7.5bn of "contingent capital". According to Lloyds, the EC state aid remedies will not be "material" to the group, trading is in line with expectations and synergies will be over 1.5bn. However, a dividend is unlikely until 2012.

RBS is also a hold. The third-quarter loss of 1.5bn compares with 3.5bn in the preceding three months. However, the important news was that although it has shrunk the size of the assets covered by the APS and also the fees paid, it is required to make materially more disposals than it had expected. We believe it is going to be a long hard slog for RBS.

http://www.investorschronicle.co.uk/MarketsAndSectors/Sectors/article/20091117/11b89e6c-d37c-11de-8eea-00144f2af8e8/Bank-stock-picks.jsp