Thought Id start this one going because its rather dead on this board at the moment and I suppose all my usual muckers are either at the Stella tennis event watching Dim Tim (lose again) or at Henly Regatta eating cucumber sandwiches (they wish,...NOT).

Anyway please feel free to just talk to yourself blast away and let it go on any company or subject you wish. Just wish Id thought of this one before.

cheers GF.

I think the US government should pay him for finding the wide open flaw's in their security. What if it was the Chinese or terrorist who hacked in.


Home Office: Your views on extradition wanted (by 31 December 2010)
By fg on November 11, 2010 10:24 PM | No Comments

The Conservative - Liberal Democrat coalition government is allowing members of the public (that means you!) to have a say in a review of the appalling mess which the incompetent and authoritarian previous Labour government made of the whole process of Extradition:

Remember that there was no public consultation whatsoever, and no informed debate and careful scrutiny in Parliament either, when the notorious and twice disgraced David Blunkett forced through the Extradition Act 2003 into law, which he and his apparatchiki then applied retrospectively to Gary McKinnon and to other cases. such as the Nat West 3 Bankers and Babar Ahmed. etc.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N7l4jD-EZ3k&feature=player_embedded

The President sound's a bit uneasy answering the question.

ExecLine,

Re the forced adoption case. As a regular reader of The Sunday Telegraph I have been following such cases for months. It is frightening what is happening in this country to some innocent families. No doubt the Social Services see these cases a 'easy options' over those genuine cases were they are too scared to take action.
No doubt many will have read your post and thought as I first did when I started to follow such cases, is that there must be more to it that what has been disclosed, but there often is not.
Strange how in the same newspaper it was reported that the main reason why the government is going to pay several suspected Muslim terrorists over 1,000,000 each(bear with me there is a connection) was because they have been advised that if these people were not paid, they would take court action that could result in sensitive security information being released in court, 'and that as it is the main thread of our law that justice must be seen to be done, and therefor such proceedings could not be in a closed court'. and yet all family courts are closed courts.
As the author of these reports stated a few weeks ago, most people on reading these case studies would think that they were occurring in a third world dictatorship , not our so called democracy.
No wonder some people are reluctant to contact Social Services if they need help, or are reluctant to take there children to hospital if they get a bad knock from play.

And for those who make excuses for the social services, saying that it is a very difficult job to define accidental injury to intended injury (abuse), it is not as hard as you think.
As many know, in my career as a Police Officer I had many dealings with this agency.
A few in this profession are very good, but many are degree holding kids, that although very bright academically have about as much common sense as my little finger. Their managers are also of a similar ilk

A family ripped apart for little or no reason is a scandal.

.

Like the police, the social services deal with simple (easy) cases effectively.

One problem with those working in social services are that many of those recruited, are from a pool of those who have an fixed "ideological base" and associated zeal.

Many others are from the same background of their clients and wish to change the social circumstances of those they see as partial victims of "society".

They often have enthusiasm and work hard, but lack the ability to see the "overall problem" and the lack the tools and authority to "enforce" actions, which they may think appropriate. (To use the legal system effectively, you have to have provable and supported evidence not the ill informed prejudices and opinions which many operate on.)

It is a pity, that many of the "knowing" critics don't take sabbaticals and work for a 3 months for the social services, on the "salaries" they feel appropriate for others attempting to do the job.
I think, If they were brave enough to attempt the work, many of those critics would find it a harassing and soul destroying job.

Another challenge, where physical violence is involved, is having satisfactory witness to the causation of the injuries. Suspicion is one thing, evidence if another.

Many criminals/prisoners in police cells seem to hit themselves he door knob and cause self inflicted "violence".

Ummmmmm
====================

As far as the "payments" to the villains of probable "torture" is concerned.

I know the villains were "contained" for "good reasons", but haven't seen the evidence examined in a court of law.

I think the governments' actions in avoiding court proceedings, is to cover their own consenting behaviour and embarrassments.

I think the UN have been condemned American and British behaviour on rendition etc. and think Bush should be tried for War Crimes.

--------------------------
PS.

I wouldn't mind being hung for murder, if I have found to have committed the crime in a respected court of law, but, if I haven't, please allow me a day or two in court to plead my case and/or at least plead to ask for mitigation.


Slightly edited!

.

Well, Greek and Fred, I pretty much agree with everything you both have to say on this.

I do feel so very sorry for Tony and Debbie Sims.

Their problems seemed to start off, with what looks to me, like a malicious phone call to the RSPCA about the dog's tails being docked. Logically, since only two RSPCA people went first of all for a chat, I wonder where on earth the information came from about them having guns in the house?

The report above says,

"Shortly after Mr Sims was interviewed by the RSPCA over his unwitting infringement of a new law banning the tail-docking of puppies, their home was invaded by two RSPCA officials and 18 policemen, who had been given a wholly erroneous tip-off that there were guns on the premises.

When the dogs were released from their kennels and rampaged through the house, ripping apart his daughters pet boxer, Mr Sims strongly protested verbally but not physically. He and his wife were arrested and taken away, leaving their little girl, aged five, screaming amid the chaos."

Social workers were called and the child was removed into foster care. While Mrs Sims was being held for several hours in a police cell, she had a miscarriage. She returned home that night to find her daughter gone."

What the Dickens were all these 'troops' expecting?

This is all so absolutely 'over the top', it beggars belief.

How on earth did all of this escalate from the first visit by the RSPCA into what happened during the second visit?

There must be more to this. Was Mr Sims known to the Police , apart from the Boxer what breeds were the others ? pit bull ect:

Aldwickk

I think you might just have hit the nail on the head there.

My own take on things, is that Mr Sims might well have some difficulty in seeing the other person's point(s) of view. And then one thing leads to another and everything just gets out of control.

ExecLine,

You may well be right, that there is more to it re Mr Sims not seeing the others point of view. Still does not explain why they took the children away and kept them from their parents until they were later adopted. Anyway, the main point has to be that, these family courts should be fully open. The excuses that they are closed to protect the child, is hogwash. Yes in certain rare circumstances, I see the reason, but as long as they remain closed, we do not have a clue if the authorities are being fair or heavy handed. The Telegraph articles only give full details after a case is finalized, and often their appears very little justification for the courts actions.

Mnamreh,

Your post of 1144 hrs is spot on. My experiences of these professionals is the same as yours.

N,

The problem with the "truth, is that its observation is often biased by the observer's "prejudices".

It is frustrating, that when an intervention, which is thought to be socially beneficial and agreed to and then instigated by the responsible authorities , is found to based on less than perfect information or bias.

To bring in perfect legislation to deal with the complexities of a free society is impossible.

What confuses me is why God devised free will? (Especially in the case of women.)

Objectivity, on retrospection, is often found wanting.

I am glad that the most important decisions I have to make now, are whether, I should get up in the morning to have a pee, or whether I pour myself another drink in the evening.

.

I feel a little bit like Mole, sometimes wondering when he was in the Wild Wood, why he left his home to see the World.

Like the Welshman going to London for the first time, when asked what he though of it, replied " a little disappointed".

.

Elegant, or appealing?

(Both is not allowed.) 8-)

.

Many solutions are alegant AND appealing. In fact the ideal solution to most problems is both.

So more trouble for Ireland.
The opposition party has called for a general election. I appreciate that calls such as this are not that rare, but the circumstances of the EU bale out could trigger an election through a no confidence vote.
It also looks like the UK is to provide Ireland with an additional loan, as they are according to our chancellor Mr Osborne a very important trading partner.
They may well be, but how much more money will be poured into this bottomless pit of the EU funded Euro.
Whats the point in delaying the inevitable.
If the Euro was a dog, it would have been put down by now to save it from further misery.
What is not generally accepted, is that the UK unlike Ireland has not disclosed all its bank debt, whereas we still have huge amounts still off the books.
Our total debt is far more than has been declared.
I love Ireland and the Irish, but it's about time the powers that be in the UK, realized as we the general public do, 'That the UK is just about skint'.
We can't afford any bale outs.

We are lucky that we do not have the EURO , so let them who are in it sort the mess out.

Maybe a fire sale is a good time to buy a stake in a Irish bank , after all Goldman's done alright buying Leman Bro's

Is this government going the crazy way of the last one.
We now have an idea to calculate how, 'Happy we are'.
If you are given the chance to complete a 'Happiness' survey, please don't do it.
I suspect that once the results of such a survey are know, there will be regulations/rules to abide by. I wonder if a scale of happiness would be forthcoming.
Eventually there could be a Government Happiness Zsar, with him/her as head of a Happy department.
How about a Ministry of happiness.
After all I remember a documentary in 1970, which showed a Labor Government Minister who was in charge of a Ministry of Silly Walks. At least I think it was a documentary. Cant remember the ministers name though.
Just had another thought. I wonder how high Gordon Brown would score in a happyness pole, as most of the time he looked like a dog chewing a wasp.