Thought Id start this one going because its rather dead on this board at the moment and I suppose all my usual muckers are either at the Stella tennis event watching Dim Tim (lose again) or at Henly Regatta eating cucumber sandwiches (they wish,...NOT).

Anyway please feel free to just talk to yourself blast away and let it go on any company or subject you wish. Just wish Id thought of this one before.

cheers GF.

I have to agree, though, that Woolworths have done the right thing - or been obliged to do the right thing - in withdrawing the Lolita bed. I am very concerned about the sexualisation of children and find it wholly inconsistent that we publicise the names of paedophiles in a national register to protect children from that particular threat of abuse, yet do not protect them from exploitation by corporations who value profits over the right of young people to enjoy being children for as long as possible.

Woah there, ST.
Starting to get a couple of serious posts!!!!

In that vein, I have a brother and his girlfriend who claim incapacity benefit, and many other acquaintances who also claim.
While I do not grudge a single farthing to those who are genuinely incapacitated, I struggle with the wisdom of what is deemed incapacitated for work.
I think the government are doing the right thing in addressing the nature of the tests. I look at many, who may not be in any condition to swing a pickaxe for 8 hours a day, but there is very little excuse for not been able to answer a phone or use a computer, or many other tasks. Stephen Hawking solves the mysteries of the universe on the back of a fag packet and they don't get much more incapacitated than that!! The guys down to about the use of a single eyebrow!!
No. Its about time we asked the woman who claims due to her obesity if she can use a phone. If she can, she can do some work, even if it is only token.
My brother and his missus can both drive and are mobile, but they claim incapacity benefit quite happily, and legally, because they are little worse off than working at the kind of jobs available to them. Something wrong there. Sorry to sound all right wing, but there is.
The genuinly incapacitated should be up in arms, because if those kinds of claimants give the whole thing a bad name and take resources away from the genuine and deserving cases.

You don't sound right wing. Alan, just sensible. My original point on this was merely to point out that the unemployment figures have 'fallen' since Thatcher's time purely because they now put the numbers elsewhere - i.e. incapacity benefits!

:o)

Alan, I agree entirely that those who are able to work in some capacity should not be enabled to live off the state - or should at least engage in a reasonable proportion of contributive employment. If I was in a position to work I would do so happily. Sadly with chronic fatigue, I am able to do a little at home (such as a couple of hours on the computer, in total, each day), but if I push past this I quickly get into a vicious circle of increasing exhaustion which does then lead to total incapacity. (Ideally, when I re-establish a certain level of fitness, I'd like to go back to some kind of paid work for 3 days per week and spend the rest of the time writing my first blockbuster movie/novel/whatever!). I think it's a great pity that some people claim an inability to work due to conditions such as obesity - then again, I have met people who are extremely obese and need at times to be lifted (with a mechanical hoist) out of bed or cannot walk more than a few yards without getting completely out of breath. Compulsive eating and the like can be as disruptive to normal living as depression, severe pain, etc.

It is a pity that your brother and his wife apparently can't find the kind of work to which they would be suited if they were fully fit. I guess they are intelligent and capable people, but can only find the kind of work that is increasingly being farmed out to children in the Philippines or illegal immigrants in this country. I feel sorry for them as individuals, but would think it would be far better if people in such positions worked, even if it was on a part-time basis as a concession to the fact that the work is not what they are suited to.

I'll save the rights and wrongs of pole-dancing seven-year-olds for another time! ;o)

Or to put it another way, I too feel tempted to ask the obese woman why she can't stop eating cheeseburgers, get off her A and start doing something useful with her life. Then again, if she left school at 16 unable to read, spent the next few years having half a dozen future-NEET children by various fathers and propping up the counter of her local McDonald's every day whilst dwelling on the gloominess of her prospects, the damage now done is going to be a challenge to reverse.

At least now she can get a McA level with fries, so all is not lost.
I believe the government have it about right if they follow the idea of assessing not ones incapacity for work, but what one can do, if anything.
The downward spiral you refer to is not related to IB. It is a sad state common to many areas, rural and inner city, but is the answer to support these actions and try to understand them as some kind of social disease, or is it better to think of it as requiring "tough love". Making it increasingly financailly difficult to exist in this state, so the more able, and therfore more lazy, get out of the spiral and teach their children of the moral satisfaction of earning a crust, and dare I say it, getting a bit more from life.
You see, I always think there is a danger that too many kids are brought up, seeing mum & dad do almost nothing, finding another way to play the state, and still having a relatively comfortable life. You just know the kids will grow up to expect no more, and that is tragic and needs halting. Fast.
In short, is it worth some casualties to restore a long lost work ethic, or shall we start writing the epitaph for that ethic, as the cost of restoring it is too high.

Anyway, enough of the serious stuff.
On a lighter note, what about the Bishop who got death threats from a load of muslims who he ticked off a bit.
Gotta admire either his balls or his stupidity when he decides to try and pacify them by saying he just meant they should be welcomed in a Christian way.
Would that be the Christian way of raiding their home countries to convert them as King Richard did?
Note to Bishop; I think what they didn't really like was the Christian way, and thats one of the reasons they are a bit tetchy toward you.
Anyway, give my regards to Salman Rushdie, cos I think you're likely to be moving next door to him soon.

I've checked the date.
It isn't the first of April.
I looked behind my cornflakes and their was no sign of his Noeliness, Noel Edmonds with a Gotcha Oscar.
It isn't even a stunt to commemorate the death of Beadle.
So it must be that a general election is coming.
I'm basing this on an early contender for muddled thinking of the year award that I read this morning.
Labour are slowly clawing the opinion polls back and the tories are worried. Some bod has decided the best way to counter this is to wheel out an ancient tory from the years of The Maggon, to say something stupid.
Enter, stage left, Lord Tebbit.
In a week where a local 13 year old was charged with a stabbing at a local school. In a 12 months where youth gun and knife crime is universally considered the biggect threat to society and more people than ever before (according to a survey) are scared to go on the streets after dark, Lord Tebbit has the answer.
He proposes we give all boys and young men guns and teach them to shoot, to rid them of the aggression and need for violence they currently take out on their X Box.
He reasons if they spend their time on the moors turning birds into clouds of feathers and dust, or reducing the rabbit population, they will go home to help old ladies across the road and perform charitable works. Theres no way they will use their new found skills for the purposes of , say, getting rid of their drug debt problem, or hijacking cars or anything.
Hmmm.
Methinks Lord Tebbit could have an instructive few hours explaining that one to the good people of Hungerford. Or Dunblane.
All we need now is for the current tory leadership to fulfill part two of the plan. To step forward and remind us all how much better the tories are now and that we should all be grateful that they have changed so much.
Its a great plan, spoiled only by one thing. Labour can counter it by wheeling out Kinnock and Hatton and saying the same thing.

SIlly old sod. I don't think anyone is going to take him seriously, they never did that much. He's not representative of the current Tories and was never that representative in Thatchers days.

He does have a point to a certain degree, though, in that getting them involved in something that is exciting, with a bit of controlled danger - such as an outward bounds course

http://www.outwardbound.org.uk/home.html

would be a way of channeling their aggression and building their self-worth. Maybe we need a scheme to make these courses available to all kids, especially those vulnerable to the gun/knife culture.

I think I might support the party that brings back the days of the Gladiator, let them take their aggression out in a Gladiator stadium..................throw in a few lions and they'll definitely get my vote.

Now theres an idea that covers itself in margarine and rumbles round my underpants........................
Could we have James Alexander Gordon reading the results every Satrurday Teatime? Car theives 47 dead v Vandals 47 dead, Score Draw.
I'm liking it....................

Norman Tebbit as ref?

Just googled the idea and apparantly it was tried before by Peter Hain.
Unfortunately the results were inconclusive and despite filling Wembley with spectators, the official returns showed only 17 people attending and a net loss of exactly the amount allowed to be carried forward for corporation tax purposes.
Commenting on the Mr Hain said there was some suggestion that the crowd figures were manipulated, but that the 47million spent on Winalot to smear on the partcicpants to attract the lions was a legitimate expense, and had nothing to do with his mate being chairman of Winalot.
We believe him entirely, and consider his financial and tax affairs to be as pure and innocent as a 1947 Disney cartoon. And just as factual.

BTW.
Just thought. The Romans always had a guy doing the thumbs up or down bit at the end. We need one of those.
Wonder if that copper who was suspended is available?

I think it would help if these boys/girls had somewhere other than street corners to go! Free boxing/wrestling/ gym sessions somewhere to work off their energy and aggression. To give Norman his due the idea isn't all daft--there is clay pigeon shooting or paint balling!! How much actual fun do some of these youngsters have?
All over the world it's becoming more obvious that so called civilised behavior is little more than superficial. Hey it's Sunday--how about a joke or two!

What about Boris? He'd add a sense of fun to the proceedings.

moneyplus

I agree with what you say. There isn't anywhere where kids can go 'for free' other than the 'street corner'. There isn't anything they can do for free other than amuse themselves by taking some kind or low, medium or high risk by getting involved in some mischief or other. They are absolutely bored out of their brains.

Particularly, with the Olympics coming along, this is where we ought to be spending tons of money. Namely on free sporting activities for kids. Things like free outdoor illuminated pitches for basket ball, soccer, tennis, baseball, fives courts, biking ramps, skateboard ramps, roller skating rinks, cricket nets, bowling alleys, gymnasiums, boxing, wrestling, judo, kung fu and other martial arts facilities, etc, etc, etc., so that there can be some organised competitions and leagues.

Indeed, every town or urban area should have extensive facilities of this sort so that kids can either participate or just go and be able to hang out as spectators.

So what's different from when most of us were kids? I would suggest that kids of today have a hell of a lot more to do than I ever did. PCs, Ipods, game consoles, trot down McDonalds and other stuff besides. The problem is not that they don't have anything to do but that they would rather cause trouble by crossing the line; why do they cross the line? Because they don't have values. Where do they get their values from? Mainly their parents and society to a degree. I wonder how many teenagers of today are members of their local library? I would hazard a guess and say not very many.

I'll echo PTH.
And more to the point there is loads of free stuff to do and places to go.
Leeds is awash with out of school activities and evening meets. The simple and unescapable fact is if you provide youths with these things, they wreck 'em.
Be honest, what was the last playpark you saw without broken and vandalised equipment? When did you last see a skatepark not trashed and strewn with broken bottles and graffitti? Which was the last football field you saw where you would feel safe on an evening?
In one area of Leeds, the social services organised Go Kart racing days and trips to Alton Towers one summer holiday. All you had to do was turn up at the meeting point with 2 and they would take you, get you in and give you lunch. It was abandoned due to a lack of take up, while at the same time police reported the usual increase in youth crime that always comes with the summer holidays.
No, the answer is they have too much. Our generation had much less and though we were no angels, we certainly did not cause the problems that exist today.

Hmm, it's all down to discipline and respect I'm afraid. Unfortunately the 'do-gooders' who think they know everything want us to respect the youth of today; if we don't WE will be disciplined. It is not the fault of the local thug when he/she beats up your granny because she won't hand over her last coin to help him/her buy heroin; he/she had a 'disturbed' childhood so we should let him/her off and help him/her by giving him/her endless benefits plus a home where he/she can get together with his/her dubious mates to plan the next football etc riot. Next time I see a gang of misunderstood, deprived youths kicking the sh*t out of a misguided member of public who dared to remonstrate with them for tipping a disabled person out of their wheelchair for fun, I will congratulate them on their innovative way of making entertainment for themselves. I mean, who could criticise them for that? I wish I had thought of entertainment like that when I was young, much better than the games of football, cricket, tennis and loads of other things which I used to do!: those things are still available in most places and lots of today's youth take part, it's the minority shite that cause trouble and God help anyone who lifts a finger to try to stop it. Shove the do-gooders into the Gladiator stadium along with half our politicians and all the Euro bureaucrats, let loose the lions and then ask today's minority shite 'yoof' if they'd like to take their aggression out on the lions after they have finished, that's what I suggest.