Thought Id start this one going because its rather dead on this board at the moment and I suppose all my usual muckers are either at the Stella tennis event watching Dim Tim (lose again) or at Henly Regatta eating cucumber sandwiches (they wish,...NOT).

Anyway please feel free to just talk to yourself blast away and let it go on any company or subject you wish. Just wish Id thought of this one before.

cheers GF.

Jimmy as long as you dont involve Edwina and use common sense.you can be as extremist as you like.and dont forgeta Politician is someone who's there when he needs you

'a Politician is someone who's there when he needs you'----- Brilliant
2517

That was the gag George.and did you know Edwina is like a piano when she is not upright shes grand.

And she can play major to minor?

Her Committees were always a group of men who keep minutes and shagged for hours.

Jimmy B,

Try Haiti,

You could gogo there

note to self.
tis the ides so be careful.
regards
jkd

jkd ,,,whatever it is your smoking can you get me some..

Jimmyhes been smoking it for yearsI think its called Lancashire potpot?...Without the LambPotatoesonionscarrotsturnipbut twice the strength

House of Commons
Children's Commissioner for England [1-6]
To
#Establish a Childrens Commissioner for England; to make provision for the
Commissioners duties including monitoring complaints procedures for
children, overseeing arrangements for childrens advocacy, monitoring
legislation to ensure that the needs of children are taken into account,
overseeing child death reviews and carrying out inquiries into major child
abuse cases and child deaths; and to make provision to ensure that the work of
the Commissioner is compatible with the UN Convention on the Rights of the
Child.
-------------------------
It appears to me that the Government have set up this commission to protect children.
The killers of James Bulgeras we know were also ChildrenMaggie Atkinson who was appointed to the post last autumn has insisted that Venables and Thompson should not have been prosecuted for his murder because children under the age of 12 who commit crimes are too young to understand the full consequences of their actionsso there is a message to the vast organised crime rings that already pollute this countrytake on children from broken homes under their wings for hitsblaggstheft.extortionif the children get caughtthey get helploveattention and understandingall at our expensehow do these cranks get Government positions?give a twelve year old street wise kid an I-phonemp4...laptopcomputer gametwenty Benson. Maggie Atkinson will soon see how child like these mini gangsters arerebel kids already shopliftfenceand bullywithout punishment.an ASBO has military ranking with the gangs now we want to let them murder free of chargewhat message is that giving out?. FFS!

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namrehapologise if I have offendedbut these young gangs are out of controlthe parents are normally out of control as wellI have all the love in the world for my kidsand all the good and innocent children that should be safebut the like of Venables and co. are a lost cause and menace to societyif it had not been Bulgerit could have been yours or mine?the poor Mother has had to listen to Maggie Atkinson tell the world Venables and Thompson should not have been charged for murdering her sonand it wasnt just murderit was a sickening act of violence

I agree with Maggie Atkinson. At age 10 you are a product of the environment in which you have been brought up. Ten years olds have not got the ability to take stock of themselves and decide on a set of morals for themselves. I remember doing that in my late teens. Before that, you just do and behave according to what you have been taught. Punishing a ten year old is merely punishing the wrong man. Something very bad has been done, but wanting a ten year old's head for it is a base reaction that many of us can (perhaps not easily) turn into compassion. That is why the age of criminal responsibility in other countries is 14 or 15.

Tabby,

?????????/

I don't think Atkinson is advocating that children should be excuse for "aberrant" antisocial behaviour.

She is suggesting that those children who are showing "wild" behaviour to be treated, often in units with trained therapists to try to salvage something from the psychopathic environments they have been "dragged" up in.

Hopefully, some will be able to return to society as useful members.

If there are groups of adults who are deliberately perverting children for their own personal gratification or gain, they are the ones who should be prosecuted and if found guilty punished and instituted.

Children are recognise as not being fully cognisant of the world, that is why we expect them to schools and try to guide them appropriately. There is no gain by criminalising them, revenge for some is sweet but of very little lasting value.

The main approach to criminal behaviour should be prevention, early intervention and support. Expensive in the short time but cheaper in the long term.

=====================

Tabby, my guess is that you were less than pure white in your childhood and youth, and like myself "got away" with a lot more than we should have done.

Another point, is a lot of the "aberrant" behaviour in childhood is the mimicking of the values shown by adults and shown to them in the media.

KayakI never said punishmentI said they need to be charged for their crime and taken out of society until it is clear they are safe to mix with other children
Let us just analyse your post.

Ten years olds have not got the ability to take stock of themselves and decide on a set of morals for themselves..so you are saying they have no responsibility for any of their actions?therefore violence is going to be inevitableif in their make-up

Before that, you just do and behave according to what you have been taughtso you are saying if they have been taught wrong by their parentsthey have no responsibility for any of their actions?therefore violence is going to be inevitableif in their make-up

Punishing a ten year old is merely punishing the wrong man.so you are saying they can commit proven murderas in the Bulger case but still have no responsibility for any of their actions?therefore violence is going to be inevitableif in their make-up

KayakBritain's violent crime record is worse than any other country in the European unionviolent peopleand that includes childrenneed to be charged and taken off our streetsuntil they reformany other view would be putting the innocent at risk!!!

FredI was no angelbut I took a few beatingsstanding up against violet bullies that made it their game to hurt the easy target my father was a strict disciplinarianso I soon learnt about right and wrong at a very you agewell before I was twelvethe do-gooders are more trouble than the troubled!

Nearly correct. "Responsibility for their actions" to me implies that they knew they had a choice, made what they knew in most of society to be the wrong choice, and knew that they might well face consequences for doing so. I don't think any of that would go through the mind of a ten year old.

Unfortunately most people don't have the sort of disciplinarian parent that you had. Is it right to punish children for a lack of discipline at home? I doubt it. Personally I would punish the parents. I might not give them life imprisonment for a murder, but I would certainly try them in place of their children for any crimes and misdemeanours their children committed.

Also, a lot of children's morals come from their peers. If they hang out with peers who have similar discipline issues, it's not a surprise they try to fit in.

Finally, if the parents are unable to bring up their kids 'properly' then they should not be doing the job and the kids should be taken away for their own sake. The problem with that position, though, having spoken to a number of social workers recently, is that they have nowhere near the level of resources required to do that. There are far too many kids not being brought up properly, so they can only act in cases where the situation has exploded.

Country Number of violent crimes
1 UK 1,158,957
2 Austria 133,546
3 South Africa 732,121
4 Sweden 108,004
5 Belgium 107,885
6 Canada 306,559
7 Finland 41,664
8 Netherlands 111,888
9 Luxembourg 3,233
10 France 324,765

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Kayak - I agree with your logic re parents being punished for crimes there little darlings commit. Unfortunately the parents today get away with the crimes they commit and unless there is radical change they will probably get away also with the crimes there children commit! This country has been going to the dogs since the sixties, 'Spare the rod spoil the child' Who said that?