Thought Id start this one going because its rather dead on this board at the moment and I suppose all my usual muckers are either at the Stella tennis event watching Dim Tim (lose again) or at Henly Regatta eating cucumber sandwiches (they wish,...NOT).

Anyway please feel free to just talk to yourself blast away and let it go on any company or subject you wish. Just wish Id thought of this one before.

cheers GF.

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What I find interesting, is Cameron's into get work dodgers of the benefits system into to work.

Yet again, he is reducing the probable number of jobs and increasing unemployment by his "proposed" cut backs and "efficiency" moves.

If the public swallow this then they are madder than I think.

Also interesting the polls suggest hung parliament and I find it difficult for a tory/lib pact with said policy differences and the fight on proportional representation which would remove the chances of tories being in power again.

It is still all to play for.

Hi Fred,

There is no getting away from the fact that no matter who gets in, jobs will suffer because of the cuts all parties will have to make.
The difference is that the Conservative say they will force people on the dole 'Who are offered a job' to take it or cut their benefits.
I appreciate that all parties are only as good as their actions, and not as good as their promises, but what we do have is Labours proof that their actions re getting people off the dole and into work have not materialised. Remember they promised 13 years ago to cut benefits for those who do not need then, but just want others to pay for their, sit all day, sponging off others, lifestyle. Have they succeeded, no way, as there are now more on benefits than ever.
Not a Brown fan (obviously) but for his own sake as well as the countries, I hope he does not get in, due to his looking beaten and ill.
Notice I did not say re-elected, as he was never elected in the first place.
Brown and this Government are a busted flush. At least we should give the Conservatives a chance to play their hand.

I could not believe Browns opening lines in the debate when he said, "But I do know how to run the economy".
Thats like a Burglar asking you to trust him with the keys to your house when you go on holiday.
I expected him to follow this up with, 'Just look at my record'.
He didn't, so I will. Just look at it.
Nuf said

Fred---Do you not think there is any money to be saved through efficiency measures?
2517

25,

Not if it causes an increase in unemployment, which Camerons lunatic economics will certainly do.

In a period of full employment cutting numbers of individuals working inefficiently would ormay increase productivity and therefore, may produce increased gross income. Different circumstances and different arguments.

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Greek.

Who would you prefer to employ during a period of rising unemployment, a person who doesnt want to work in a job he dislikes, or a person who wishes to work at any reasonable employment, which is offered him even if he dislikes it.

I know which person I would prefer to employ.

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In a period of full employment it may be gainful to pressurise the unemployed, or even the unemployable, to do some work for society as a whole.

Those circumstances in present society are unusual and to do so is more for emotional satisfaction and a probably a waste of effort.

Many, who decry the unemployed, or unemployable, are unlikely to have undertaken manual, or low paid work themselves. Sometimes such avoidance has been due to circumstances of birth and less on intelligence, or acquired skills. I.E they have been born into families, who have better than average parenting skills, or the necessary finances, to purchase them for their offspring.

I know many previous colleagues and their children who left school, some going straight to university and then into various professions, without any real exposure or awareness of the conditions of work of their future clients, or even that of the individuals who provide every day services for them.

Many of them, are being happy to be blind to their ignorance.

==================================

I am ignorant of the unemployment levels during the War periods in this country. (Not happy about admitting this.)


Camerons rhetoric on the unemployed simply increases resentment between different groups and appeals to those who see simplistic solutions and appeals to the them and us scenario.

I think Camerons views on economics, like the majority of his policies are, is similarly simplistic and appeal to the emotional resentments of the electorate and will increase divisions in society.

His ill developed policies, will lead to increasing fragmentation within society in a period when greater cohesion would be more advisable.

I still believe a hung parliament is possible. If this occurs I think if the government if the show maturity may be able to resolve some of the colossal problems before them in a reasonable manner.

Reforms of the Houses of Commons and Lords, reforms of taxation, reforms of electoral system, reforms of the financial service and the economy just for starters.

But I am just a bigot. who has formed an opinion by thinking than following his herd.

But, I am still a little amused by the term.

Is it a minority are bigoted or the majority?

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Suggest, unless you havent already read "In Praise of Idleness" by Bertrand Russell, 1932, have a look at it. I think it is worth a few minutes.

======================

Ideology

Well, remember that what an ideology is, is a conceptual framework with the way people deal with reality. Everyone has one. You have to to exist, you need an ideology. The question is whether it is accurate or not.

=================================

Another wild thought.

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A holy man was having a conversation with the Lord one day and said, "Lord, I would like to know what Heaven and Hell are like."

The Lord led the holy man to two doors.

He opened one of the doors and the holy man looked in.. In the middle of the room was a large round table. In the middle of the table was a large pot of stew, which smelled delicious and made the holy man's mouth water.

The people sitting around the table were thin and sickly. They appeared to be famished. They were holding spoons with very long handles that were strapped to their arms and each found it possible to reach into the pot of stew and take a spoonful. But because the handle was longer than their arms, they could not get the spoons back into their mouths.

The holy man shuddered at the sight of their misery and suffering.

The Lord said, "You have seen Hell."

They went to the next room and opened the door.. It was exactly the same as the first one. There was the large round table with the large pot of stew which made the holy man's mouth water. The people were equipped with the same long-handled spoons, but here the people were well nourished and plump, laughing and talking. The holy man said, "I don't understand."

It is simple," said the Lord. "It requires but one skill. You see they have learned to feed each other, while the greedy think only of themselves."

Last month a world-wide survey was conducted by the UN.

The only question asked was:-

"Would you please give your honest opinion about solutions to the food shortage in the rest of the world?"


The survey was a huge failure because of the following:

1. In Eastern Europe they didn't know what "honest" meant.
2. In Western Europe they didn't know what "shortage" meant.
3. In Africa they didn't know what "food" meant.
4. In China they didn't know what "opinion" meant.
5. In the Middle East they didn't know what "solution" meant.
6. In South America they didn't know what "please" meant.
7. In the USA they didn't know what "the rest of the world" meant.
8. In Australia they hung up as soon as they heard the Indian accent.

The only way to solve the economic problems involves realising that out country is not rich enough to afford all that we would like. It involves getting out of the EU so that we can slash red tape, axing around a third of government jobs (over a few years) slashing benefits and encouraging people to save and not borrow money just to spend on holidays, cars, entertainment etc. Ignoring fools like Fred would also help.

TIM,

Oh, little Englander, have you not learnt anything from the economic chaos created by lack of international regulation and implementation sufficient of present regulations.

The abuses by the Bankers and Financial Intelligentsia and other greedy followers, who were out for a quick buck, are primarily responsible for the present situation.

They thrived on instability.


Regulations are needed for the running of an efficient society.

The problem is knowing which regulations are useful and which should be modified.

In the present economic situation more political and economic cooperation is needed.

In spite of its present problems the EU could develop to be a useful stabilising block, both politically and economically.

I have no doubt, that you will disagree with all of the above and I can see that the "grab and run philosophy", with its disregard of others, as more appealing to you.

Don't drink to much lager as well?

Good luck.

If it is a hung parliament, in spite of what Clegg and Cameron are saying at the moment, I doubt that the Liberal party's morality would allow them to form a coalition government with the present isolationist tory party.

Somebody, has just said to me, "what a mess it will be if the Cameron gets elected". That was the perception of Wishy Washy, from an eight year old, without prompting.

Morning Fred--The problem with being a 'staunchie' of whatever party, your's happens to be labour, is that they close their eyes to any/all indiscretions by their party, but do the opposite for the other party's. The same applies to ideas and policies, they are rubbished out of hand if their not from the chosen following, and engratiated if they are.
2517

"confirmation bias"

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No, that's the one Execline keeps banging on about :-)

25,

Inaccurate again. Other than when I work for the NCB and paid the levy, I have never a Labour party supporter or member, also I have never voted for them.

At the moment, I agree with a large number of the present labour party policies and much of what they have done while in government.

Also have sympathies for some of the Liberal and Green Party's policies.

============

Cameron turned his bask on his own and Porky's indiscretions. Paid back the money some money for false claims and now wishes to crack down on unemployment benefits.

I think he should have been prosecuted. If he worked in local government as an employee he probably would have been.

Hypocrisy of the first order.

Tory backers avoid British taxes and buy votes in the hope of a "government", what else do they want to dodge.

To many what they are doing is seen as corruption and doesn't say much for a future bought tory government, if they were to attain office.

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I hope there is a hung government as I predicted in May 2009.

At that time, I believe from memory Haystacks (the intellectual giant) predicted a tory landslide.

Not a landslide, but a majority. And I still predict that. One poll today puts the Conservatives 10 points ahead. Labour is still a poor 3rd. One poll pots them on 24%. That's the worst showing since 1918.

Gillian Duffy has said in an interview tat she is not voting at all and has not posted her vote. The interview is with The Mail on Sunday.

"He wanted me to go outside with him and shake his hands for the camera but I said no," she told the newspaper.

BIGOT = Brown Is Gone On Thursday

IMV it's only the army of benefit dependent voters created by labour that will prevent a landslide victory for the tories. Up to a million of which are youngsters, many of them have absolutely no inclination of getting a job and are happy to remain on benefits indefinitely. Until going to work is actually more beneficial than relying on handouts, this will not change. T I M 's post 8986, the first sentence is spot on.

Morning Fred----re 'Inaccurate again' you have an obvious hate for all things tory, and love of all things labour, as for saying you are not a labour supporter your posts say otherwise, as far as I know you happen to be the first non voting 'staunchie' I have exchanged views with.
2517

25,

Check the meaning of bigot and zealot and see if either or both apply to yourself.

Also check the meaning of irrational, which I think suits your rants to a tee.

Fred--Bigot --one blindly and obstinately devoted to a particular creed or party.
Zealot--An enthusiast, a fanatic.
Irrational--not reasonable, absurd, not logical.
Recognise anyone?

I don't think any of my posts could be considered as rants, if you point them out I'll gladly reassess, but hey, I don't mind you having yours.
2517

Will Wall street be open tomorrow ?

Bigot --one blindly and obstinately devoted to a particular creed or party.
Zealot--An enthusiast, a fanatic.
Irrational--not reasonable, absurd, not logical.
Recognise anyone?

Yes , anybody who will be voting Labour.