Thought I'd start a new thread as this is going to be a major talking point this year...have not made up my mind yet...(unlike bucksfizz)....but thinking of voting for an exit as Europe is not doing Britain any good at all it seems....

“I do think that we are winning and the ugly scenes we have been seeing here just lately shows how desperate our most extreme opponents are now becoming. I think we all get that there is a principle at stake and no one has been scared away. I really admire Gina Miller in particular for the way she came back after what she had to go through – it was the fact she’s a lady that made it so disgusting. These people as I say know absolutely nothing about what Britain is about.”

For all that, Bray is optimistic and 
there is no doubt at all in his mind that Brexit can and will be stopped in the year ahead. “I am absolutely certain that we will not leave the European Union and that we will come out of this a stronger and more unified country than we were before. All of the most deprived areas I know voted for Brexit because they genuinely thought the people campaigning for it were their friends and that they cared. I think they know now who their real friends are. After this is all over, we must become a lot more compassionate as a society and be willing to listen a lot more.”

That nutter is giving Bray a bad name.

Proud to be the new British.

no real surprise for similar splits in the labour party as in the conservatives to be shown loud and clear ...... anyone with half a brain cell knew it anyway ......

today's observer headline
corbyn faces furious labour backlash over backing brexit
leader accused of betrayal on second poll
party in danger of losing young backers

Manuel.

Did you read the article?

If so, read it again.

I think if you read what JC is supposed to have said carefully you may realise that the interpretation you are emphasising is slanted by your own wishful thinking.

-=-==-=

Personally, I would like him to come out against the BREXIT SUICIDE pact, but realise until the "negotiation" and residual "deal" is finalised to do so at the moment would immediately be jumped upon by the Betrayers of Britain, as Corbyn wishing to refuse or satisfy the "Willies of the People".

When the "final deal" is declared and shown that if accepted the result would be catastrophic for the UK, then would be his time to advocate another referendum.

Maybe wrong, maybe right.

From Observer "Your Letters"


Opinion Brexit
Letters: no second Brexit vote is an affront to democracy
Without another referendum, increasing numbers of voters will be disenfranchised
Sun 23 Dec 2018 06.00 GMT


Freezing democracy by preventing a further vote is undemocratic (“Chaos reigns. The only viable option left is a second vote”, Editorial). Intrinsic to democracy is regular consultation of the people.

You might argue that after an overwhelming majority vote it would be unnecessary to have any further votes on a topic for some time; however, the reverse logic equally applies.

A small majority indicates that the electorate is seriously divided and, as events and people move on, that majority opinion could easily shift. Given that the terms of the EU withdrawal agreement were unknown at the time of voting, that the Leave vote was not overwhelming, that two countries in the UK voted to remain and that the UK faces some of the most important series of decisions in its recent history, exercising further democracy can only be just.


It is quite ridiculous to suggest that calling for a vote is against democracy. Voting is what democracy is all about and it should not exclude the option to change direction completely.

Paul Young

Weybridge, Surrey

You outsiders better start criticising your own motley crew before starting on anyone else.

JC TM’s savior who would have thought it.

Thousands.

They noticed she needed saving from herself and the torrid party from her!

Anyway roll on the inevitable 1st informed referendum then we can all return to some form of normality... apart from those who will leaving us of course.

Ha! Ha! Another Remoan loser

Paul Young that is.

What part of the world will you be departing to then George?

As a former trade union member, or so you crack on about but we see no evidence of why did you join one in the first place?

I'll be staying put Stan, it's for the Remoaners to flee the UK, they obviously dislike it here or they wouldn't be talking the UK down at every opportunity.

If the Remoaners got behind the referendum verdict, we could have sailed through the Brexit negotiations but because they didn't it's turned into a fiasco.

I was a trade union member I would disagree that I 'crack on about it'. I joined for the same reasons as millions of others, pay, conditions etc. Whilst I could equally have received the same benefits as a non-member, morally it wasn't right.

As far as evidence is concerned I don't believe that is possible, so you only have my word.

I did say originally what TU were you a member of, so which one was it.

He should stick to singing.

It's more of an affront now to carry out the wishes of the people in the first referendum.

Merry Christmas all , enjoy your last one in the EU.

95 days to go.

Dil,

You may never get the Xmas present you want.

I'm sure it's not the first time you've been affronted, Dilbert. What with all them sheep and all that...

:o)

My good wishes to all and long may the banter and goodwill continue.

Unlike you iturama I think Trump has made good progress and has at least spread a little light on the grubby workings of the State.