Will this increase or decrease the likelihood of terrorist actions in America, Europe and the rest of the world?

If you were a member of a family murdered in this conflict, would you be seeking revenge?

Should Tzipi Livni and Ehud Olmert, be tried for war crimes if or when this conflict comes to an end?

What will the price of oil be in 4 weeks time?

Haystack

Is this the article you're misrepresenting with your statement: "The article expressed understanding for Hamas' refusal of such conditions"?

Why would you imply that The Economist sympathises with Hamas's refusal? Did you even read the article? Or was it another blind cut and paste from a partisan news agency? Maybe this one: ABNA (fundamentalist Shia news agency)? Amongst its many insane ramblings is a press release that is a word for word copy of your post above.


Bringing Hamas to the table

Sep 2nd 2010, 14:50 by Lexington

THIS is straying out of area but with Egypt's President Mubarak staying in the hotel at the bottom of my road in DC and blocking local traffic it is probably permissible.

Anyhow, I was delighted at the beginning of this week's Middle East peace summit in Washington to hear George Mitchell, America's peace envoy, nail the much-quoted argument that Hamas should be invited into the peace process in Palestine, just like the IRA was in Northern Ireland. This is what he said:

Let me say theyre very different And while we should learn what we can from other processes, each is unique... But on the central point, the reality is that in Northern Ireland, Sinn Fn, the political party that is affiliated with the IRA, did not enter the negotiations until after 15 months had elapsed in the negotiations, and only then because they met two central conditions that had been established. The first was a ceasefire, and the second was a publicly stated commitment to what came to be known as the Mitchell Principles because I was the chairman of the commission that established them.

Exactly. Of course there will be no final deal on Palestine without the acquiescence of Hamas, which represents at least half of the Palestinian movement and controls the Gaza Strip. Of course it should be at the table at some point. But Hamas has so far locked itself out of the talks by its refusal to accept the three conditions laid down by the international community: a ceasefire, recognising Israel and abiding by previous agreements signed between Israel and the Palestinians. I understand why agreeing to these conditions is difficult for a movement with Hamas's history. But, please, no more IRA comparisons.

More Abna 'news agency' gems:

Is it true that mc D is using pork fat to keep the fries crunchy?

Hello

This is your answer about the using of pork in the MC products.

Yes, MC uses the pork in some of its products. We have evidence through the MC site that you can see it in the MC site here:

http://nutrition.mcdonalds.com/nutritionexchange/nutrition_ingredients.html?DCSext.destination=http://nutrition.mcdonalds.com/nutritionexchange/nutrition_ingredients.html

It is notable that the MC is an Anti Islam corporation and the supporter of Occupier Israel and US. And you know how these behave with the Muslims especially the innocent Palestinians. We think it is better not to use its product, because of this; the buyer of their products in a different way would support the act of Israel and US with Muslims in the ME and throughout the world.

For being more aware of the companies witch support the Occupier of the Palestine visit the link below: BRANDS & LABELS TO BOYCOTT
9/11 was a CIA-Mossad inside job


News agency? Or Nutjobs? You decide.

Thanks for that Gausie. Reading Haystacks original post I don't know whether to laugh or cry.

I did read the Economist article and I did copy the post from a news agency and not the one that you mention.

I did not say sympathises. I said understands, which is what the article says. Understands is pretty accurate. sympathises is not.

I would not make the comparison with Hamas and the IRA. I have no sympathy with the IRA at all and regard them as a terrorist organisation. Hamas are fighting for the return of their land, which has been stolen by Israeli terrorists.

(anti)semitic semantics?

i confess when i read "understands" in hayseed's post, i also understood it to mean "sympathises", as the word is often used to mean that in english ..... i can't get inside his head (thank goodness), but given the source of the post, i'm damn sure that was what was intended, arguably with an intentional weasel escape route

Cynic,

Which village in England do you originate from?

I doubt that "sympathise" and "understand" are synonymous for the majority of those who speak English.

I think that I am beginning to have some understand some of the problems which you have with comprehension of the reasoned arguments of others.

because clearly you didn't learn english except as a foreign language

The source "ABNA (fundamentalist Shia news agency)" quoted by Gause is NOT the source of the article. Even they quote a source where they got it from.

I take the point about 'sympathise' and 'understand' having similar uses at times, but my undertanding (there's that word again) was of the more precise use of the word.

no one disputes that "understand" can mean precisely understand OR sympathise!

was it not the white rabbit who said that he said what he meant and that it meant what he said it meant - or somesuch?

.

N,

You haven't experienced the same women as I have.

.

Amazing Map of Middle East

(fascinating changes with continued instability)

This is an amazing, constantly changing map of the Middle East region, illustrating how various "empires" have risen and fallen in the past 5000 years--in just 90 seconds
http://www.mapsofwar.com/images/EMPIRE17.swf

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-11278903

Israeli tank fire kills three in Gaza

At least three Palestinians have been killed by tank fire near the border between Israel and the Gaza Strip, reports say.

Medical staff and witnesses said Israel fired shots across the border near the town of Beit Hanoun in Gaza.

One report said the two of those killed were a 91-year-old man and his 33-year-old grandson.

Militants in the Hamas-run Gaza Strip earlier fired a rocket into Israel but no casualties or damage were reported.

Adham Abu Salima, a spokesman for medical services in Gaza, told AFP news agency that the 91-year-old victim had been a caretaker at a farm.

His grandson died shortly afterwards from his wounds, he said.

Prominent rabbi tells Erdogan: There can be no peace without Hamas

A prominent rabbi from a settlement in the West Bank has informed Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan that there can be no real peace in occupied Palestine or the wider Middle East without the involvement of Hamas, the Islamic Palestinian liberation movement.

The Rabbi, Menahem Fruman, met with Erdogan in Istanbul a few weeks ago.

Fruman believes that since Hamas more or less represents Islam, there can be no lasting peace between Jews and Muslims without recognizing the central role of Islam in peace-making in the region and the world at large.

The rabbi also believes that since Jews lived a good part of their history under Islam in peace, there is no reason why they can't have the same experience again.

Fruman said he emphasized to Erdogan that all current peace efforts, led by the United States, were doomed to failure since people who really represent the Palestinian people, namely the Hamas movement, were not involved in the process.

Fruman, who lives at the settlement of Tkeou near Bethlehem, added that any peace deal that ignores the centrality of Islam in the region wouldn't succeed in the long run.

"I think Jews have to make peace with Islam first and foremost. Peace with secular forces in the Arab world would lead to nowhere. Only peace with Islam would be genuine and long-lasting."

The rabbi added that Erdogan agreed with him that without the involvement with Hamas in peace talks, the entire peace process would be dubious and fruitless.

the converse is also true with regard to so-called Islam - not the genuine article ones, who would be happy to get on with life rather than death - and Israel (aka the Jews)

hey parrot,
Why don't you just cut to the chase - everything Israel and Israelis do is wrong and they shouldn't exist - everything the Palestinians do is right and only they should exist. Much simpler than spending your sad life trawling the internet looking for proof-aganda to parrot interminably.
Ever heard of women? They could add something to your life. On second thoughts, no, don't bother - there isn't a woman alive who deserves you..........however bad they may be.

I agree with some of what you say. Almost everything that Israel does is wrong and Israel shouldn't exist. some of what the palestinians is not good and giving them their kland back might help that. By the way, I am married with a couple of kids.

pit ponies were never so blinkered ...... how on earth does a wife tolerate you? ..... she must be deaf or totally sub or both

from an Israeli web site.

http://www.vosizneias.com/32682/2009/06/02/israel-rabbi-harshly-condemns-violence-by-jewish-hooligans-against-arabs

Israel - Rabbis, Yesha Council members, and government ministers are coming together in order to condemn recent settler violence against Palestinians.

What happened yesterday is not violation of law and order its much worse, said Rabbi Menachem Fruman, addressing the torching of a Palestinian field in Samaria by what he referred to as hooligans.

In the past, settler leaders refrained from publically condemning radical settlers, and any disagreements remained behind closed doors. However, this time the rabbis intend to express themselves unequivocally.

There are camps that think its a good thing to burn the fields of Palestiniansit shocks me, first of all morally and also in political existential terms, Rabbi Fruman said. This builds a wall of fire between Jews and Arabs.

Meanwhile, former Knesset member, Rabbi Hanan Porat, has also joined the initiative. While condemning the evacuation of West Bank outposts, he has expressed his outrage in the face of the violent settler response.

The price tag response is immoral, he said. Its unheard of that one needs to burn the vineyards and fields of Arabs. Its immoraland it gives legitimacy to those who are interested in undermining the outpost issue. Its a very grave matter.


Targeting Palestinians and their property is a shocking thing, he said. Its an act of hurting humanity.

Fruman, who is the rabbi of Tekoa and one of the leading religious figures in Judea and Samaria, harshly condemned recent violence, which radial settlers refer to as a price tag for the evacuation of unauthorized outposts.
The rabbi is joining forces with settler leaders and ministers in condemning acts he characterized as hooligans committing the crime of hurting Palestinians.